WritingWithColor (Posts tagged mod commentary)

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midnightreigns21 asked:

Iam wanting to write a story about a girl who has asthma, a learning disability and is considered by society to be less than average. She is also a little over weight. When she has been given immortality other immortals shun her and want her dead. To escape from this she goes to a martial arts temple in China. She is also an American. I was wondering how I could incorporate both cultures in my story?

writingwithcolor answered:

Overweight Chinese American girl with asthma & learning disability, martial arts, & China

Disclaimer: I’ve written this response assuming that the main character herself is Chinese or Chinese-American. 

Some stuff I’d like to discuss point-by-point:

Being an Asthmatic

  • Asthmatics don’t exactly have the best representation in media, so I’m worried about a non-Asthmatic writing a story where the main conflict is centered around the MC’s method of coping with ableism.
  • Especially considering how we’re portrayed as stereotypical nerds/geeks for not being absolute athletes (haha maybe because pushing ourselves that far will literally result in an asthma attack-)
  • I have a feeling that in addition to the point where Chinese people are already stereotyped as nerds, having her be asthmatic as well does mean you’ll have to be more careful in how you present her. We already have the whole “model minority, East Asian = nerd” thing going for us.

Being “overweight”

  • America’s definition of “overweight” looks different for all kinds of people! 
  • Someone who’s statistically considered “overweight” by American standards might pass as being “average” (in American standards once again) and vice-versa! The existence of the word actually insinuates the existence of an ideal weight– pretty fatphobic.
  • If you mean to say that she’s fat, chubby, and/or plump, then do so. Don’t dance around the term just because it’s deemed ‘undesirable’ by our Eurocentric beauty standards. 
  • (Additionally, being chubby is associated with the nerd trope as well. More to watch out when developing her character.)
  • Mod Rune mentions the specific way you’ve phrased how as a result of her being overweight and asthmatic, she’s “considered by society to be less than average” and she’s shunned/wanted dead specifically for these two reasons.
  • Being disabled =/= incompetency or being less than an abled person. Once again, an OwnVoices situation would make sense; However I would still worry about infantilizing Asthmatic/chubby people this way.

The plot… oof.

I’m worried that your method of combating the already-delicate conflict (that she’s looking for a way to cope with her feelings of inadequacy induced by ableism/fatphobia), is pretty insulting. You specifically word her trip to China as an “escape” which I feel could have a much better reason– your excuse as is sounds to lead into a story of “refinding myself at the home of my birth culture” or something like that- especially with the fact that she’ll be doing this at a martial arts temple. A very cultural aspect of China.

Martial Arts?

  • That being said; Even though a Chinese martial artist does feel rather stereotypical, it does help with asthma (source: me and Taekwondo)
  • Specifically, according to this study from NCBI on the correlation between asthmatic children and Taichichuan, results have shown that “12 weeks of Tai-Chi-Chuan could improve the pulmonary function, decrease airway inflammation, and improve quality of life in children with mild asthma”.
  • However Northern Shaolin, Hung Ga, Wing Chun, and other Chinese forms of martial arts could work as well! Please do research on the specific techniques and differentiate between them. Appropriating Chinese martial arts on top of the fact that it’s already rather tropey- very bad.

A different plot?

  • Perhaps don’t send her off to China to quote, “escape from how other [immortals shun her and want her dead]”. 
  • I think a better motivation for this change in landscape would be “She wanted to train to get stronger and improve her health with how it was negatively impacted because of her asthma.” 
  • The thing with a lot of disabled people is that– we don’t want to have to “keep up” with abled people. We don’t want to need to take all these extra measures just to be able to function ‘normally’ (or at least the one defined by society). I feel that the motives in your original plot panders to that idea that she must get stronger or else she’ll never be accepted by the other immortals. A Chinese-American asthmatic myself, I’d much rather see her self-worth measured through her own growth as an individual than how well she ‘fits in’ with non-asthmatics.
  • Marika mentions that people also often do martial arts for culturally-relevant exercise– so this could also be a way for her to reconnect with her birth culture.
  • Sophia also mentions that being overweight has little on one’s skills as a martial artist; So it shouldn’t be used as an argument as to why someone shouldn’t be taking on a certain expertise. (Seconded, as someone who did kendo: some of the better kendoka were overweight and had more precision than I did –Jess)

Incorporating TCK Culture:

  • Look for stuff written by actual Chinese-American third-culture kids!
  • Every little part of life- from the stories parents tell their kids before bed to the kind of food we eat daily- is 100% influenced by both our caregivers and the community we live in. For me personally, we’d have hotpot dinners with other Asian families during the Lunar New Year and I’d typically be sent to Chinese school on Sundays as well. 
  • Mods Jess and Lesya touch up on some TCK elements in this ask as well! (Wanting to Learn More About Culture Because of Chinese Name) However your MC celebrates her cultures will also depend on how assimilated into America her family is.
  • Like I said earlier: look for materials that Chinese-American TCKs and immigrants have written! There’s no better way to learn about certain customs than getting them from the actual source.

My ending thoughts!

  • These are honestly traits that I’d love to see more, as an asthmatic Chinese-American myself who has done martial arts in the past, haha.
  • Be extra careful when a ton of your character’s traits are found in East Asian (Chinese) caricatures! Be sure to flesh her out as a three-dimensional character as this description that you’ve given us (regarding her conflict) makes me go >.>– I don’t like it as is.
  • Give her motivations for herself that aren’t purely to conform to others (per the submissive Asian girl trope). Having a bullied Asian girl does feel like it plays into this, so please don’t have her measure her worth as an individual based off of the standards set by abled people!
  • Do tons of research on Chinese martial arts! Marika mentions huge points below that I want you to consider when giving her a specific speciality– just saying “a martial arts temple” doesn’t cut it. 

(As always, any reader feedback/additions would be appreciated!)

~ Mod Emme

These are my thoughts as someone who has practiced various styles of Chinese martial arts. 

While the quality of the instructor and the student’s efforts are crucial, I think you need to be clear on the following:

  • The style of martial arts your character will be doing
  • Their physical limitations
  • The type of learning disability they have. 

Different fighting styles suit the limitations of different body types in different ways

  • A person who is overweight may find styles with explosive movements that put weight on vulnerable joints like the knees to be painful. Styles that favor stable stances may be more feasible than those that emphasize movements with lots of air time, crouching and jumping.
  • A person who is inflexible will need a style that encourages them to keep limber to avoid getting hurt.
  • A person with diminished lung capacity will need a style that safely challenges their endurance.

Different learning disabilities might make certain styles more or less difficult to learn

  • ADHD may favor fast fighting styles with complex move sets and a wide variety of weapons.
  • Issues associated with memory retention may make styles that emphasize sparring easier than those that focus on memorizing forms

Make no mistake, the culture of a style will be as much of a consideration for your character as the Chinese and American cultural influences. Do your research, and inquire with practitioners as to what styles would work well for your characters. 

The tumblr blog How to Fight Write would likely be a good resource on the physical logistics of different styles. 

- Marika

writingwithcolor

Commentary

@jjjustanotherhuman

I have ADHD and complex things freak me out because it’s hard to focus/learn things with many steps. We’d probaby want something that had least starts off slower/less steps in the beginning. Also, a lot of us are clumsy and lose focus and can zone out kind of at anything–so I’d at least not want to use a weapon because I hurt myself just with everyday objects.

I think one of the great things about the ND community is that how our different conditions manifest and affect our interactions with the rest of the world will vary person to person, even if the root cause is the same. This is why I said, “ADHD may favor fast fighting styles […].” For instance, I was writing the above as a person with ADHD who learned a fast martial art style with many weapons and complex move-sets after trying things like kendo or kick-boxing. The repetitive practice of the latter two were mind-numbingly boring, but the variation of Northern Shaolin kept me interested enough to stay focused. I learned at a much slower pace than many of my classmates, and yes, I did hit myself repeatedly with literally. every. weapon. This was fine. Once you hit yourself in the head with a sectioned staff for the 10th time, you’re pretty much inured to everything else. If anything, I would argue that because forms in Northern Shaolin are complex move-sets strung together, mastering them showed me it wasn’t the complexity or speed that affected my learning, but how the material was taught when it didn’t interest me. Of course, there were some forms that just “clicked”, and then the hyperfixation would kick in, which made learning them a cinch.

- Marika.

My younger sister with ADHD did Taekwondo with me when we were younger! I don’t think she was incredibly skilled or passionate about it (rather she went to the classes because our parents made us, aha) but she does do exceedingly well in classical and contemporary dance (mostly forms of ballet but others as well!) which makes use of technique and complex skills. She’s much more passionate about dance than martial arts which is why I suspect that she’s able to do so much better in neoclassical ballet than TKD! As Marika said, our conditions express themselves in different ways.

- Em

@TomatoBookworm

Remember that if you are using a “martial arts temple” you need to research the religious and cultural aspects as well. Chinese Buddhist temples keep men and women separate. Don’t send your girl to Shaolin or any other traditionally men-only temples.

A good historical note, but I think this depends on how “traditional” OP wants to go with the story. As you say, Shaolin temples are traditionally men-only, but in a more fantasy style story, who is to say? Beyond having temples be divided by gender, I’m not sure this is an important consideration, particularly if there are trans and nb members at the temple as well. The division of gender at many Buddhist temples was historically to prevent fornication, but sanghas have also historically been mixed, and certainly there are nuns who know martial arts.

- Marika.

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writingwithcolor

wredundant-writer asked:

I'm currently writing a fanfic about the non-canon children of the canon characters. One of the relationships is between a half-Chinese/half-white person and a fully white person; they have three kids. I want one of their kids (16F) to be a martial artist, but I know there are stereotypes around Asian/Chinese people and martial arts. My question is: how can I portray martial arts as means of connecting to culture, especially in a 3/4 Caucasian person?

writingwithcolor answered:

Chinese-White child doing martial arts to connect with culture

I’m not sure what you are asking here. I imagine it would be similar to writing a character who is half-white and half-Chinese learning martial arts for cultural purposes (which many part-Asian children do, by the way). 

There are likely to be some social differences that may affect your character:

  • Are they perceived as being white-presenting?
  • Do others around them believe that their white heritage “dilutes” their Chinese heritage (an unfortunate misconception)?

However, I think that’s more about their self-perception and less about using martial arts to connect with their culture. Different martial arts schools have their own cultures, value systems and so on, but, in my personal experience, many of these translate well to a variety of different cultural backgrounds. Martial arts certainly helped me connect with my Japanese heritage and Buddhism in meaningful ways. I see no reason why someone who is ¼ Chinese would culturally benefit from martial arts less than me. It’s not like the ability to relate to one’s heritage is tied to a blood quantum (See The White-Presenting Mixed Japanese Experience)

I’m not sure why you think it is stereotypical for a person of Asian descent to do martial arts. In many parts of East Asia, most forms of martial arts are regular extracurricular sports just like football, basketball or track and field would be in the US. If anything, I think you are overthinking the issue. An Asian practicing a martial art doesn’t automatically become a fighting machine. Martial arts are like any other form of structured exercise, requiring regular practice, effort, guidance, passion and some talent before proficiency is achieved. 

- Marika

writingwithcolor

Commentary

@TomatoBookworm

As a Chinese American who also writes about a canon half-Chinese half-White character in a romantic relationship with a full White character, let me step on my soapbox for a moment.

You want to trace your logic back to the parents. For your canon half-Chinese half-White character, how do they feel about their own identity? Did they grow up with Chinese culture or were they disconnected from that part of their heritage? Now as an adult, how important is it to them to pass down Chinese culture to their children, and how much can they *realistically* invest in terms of time/money/effort? How does the White partner feel about having part Chinese children and how much time/money/effort is the White partner willing to invest into raising those children with Chinese culture?

The answers to the above questions have to go deeper than a knee-jerk reaction: “of course they both want their kids to know Chinese culture.” For example, if they are both working parents, can/will they both take time off work for Chinese New Year’s Eve (the real bulk of the work) and the day of CNY? Will they take kids out of school for the celebration as well? What if there is a major school exam/group presentation/work deadline that day? How the parents decide to approach this will influence how the children relate to their culture. Is your 16yo a martial artist because the parents enrolled her in lessons since preschool, or is she seeking out martial arts because her parents didn’t empahsize Chinese culture and she’s trying to find ways to connect on her own?

This is a great comment that highlights the importance of context and tracing one’s logic. For some parents, martial arts is simply a form of exercise that they happen to be familiar with (see comment below). For others (like my mother) it’s selection was a culturally motivated choice. My mother is a Zen (Chan) Buddhist, and she viewed much of Northern Shaolin martial arts as a good way to ground me in Buddhist values.

- Marika.

@infini

as someone who is chinese and who did martial arts when i was a kid, it was less about connecting with culture and more just an activity i would do with my mom? it’s not automatically stereotypical to have a chinese character be into martial arts, but i would add other elements to connect them to their culture. usually it’s not just one thing– for me, a big connection was traditional food! if you are going to add martial arts as a factor, make sure to choose something actually specific and not just ‘martial arts’. mine specifically was wushu, if you want a point of reference.

I think this is a good point as well. Even if this is a story centered around martial arts, there should be other cultural details to present a full picture of the character’s cultural background. Your note about style is particularly important. There is significant variation between styles in terms of technique and approach. In a similar post, I have recommended the blog How to Fight Write. I do so here as well.

- Marika.

Yeah, for me, the connections to Chinese culture were more food and language (especially language). Also tangentially, Chinese New Year was always connected to the Chinese school–we never took time off day of, and it was kind of a non-holiday until my brother and I were adults. I did some Chinese dance while in elementary school and then realized I was kinda bad at it.

- Jess

@linkedsoul

I did karate for 7 years with 0 relation to my Asian culture (I’m half Vietnamese), because I frankly just wanted to do martial arts and there was a karate club near my place. It could be as simple as that! I just wanted to learn how to kick asses!

I do wonder how much relevance there actually was (or wasn’t). Karate is an Okinawan form of martial arts and influenced by Southern styles. Because martial arts in Asia were spread by trade, warfare and religion, there is tremendous opportunity for cultural relevancy of martial arts throughout the Asian continent, regardless of one’s own background.

- Marika.

My own parents would say that they put me in martial arts for self-defense and sport. Connecting to Korean culture wasn’t an intention, but it happened! As a Chinese person who did Taekwondo at a studio in a community where the majority of its businesses were run by Koreans, I became friends with a lot of Koreans, ate a lot of Korean food, had Korean teachers, etc. I’m by no means an expert on Korean culture, but I’ve had way more exposure to it than someone who (in the same position as me, a non-Korean) didn’t do Taekwondo. I do think that my parents particularly supported me doing TKD as “my” sport (over say, football or basketball) for self-defense because… that’s something femmes and women need to worry about on a daily basis. There’s also a heavy emphasis on integrity and discipline in TKD that they liked. My parents could have put me in Chinese martial arts if they really wanted me to connect to Chinese culture through it, but I think they just put me in Korean martial arts because of how closer/convenient it was to drive there several times a week.

- Em

When I started up kendo, it wasn’t so much trying to get into Japanese culture, but I had studied abroad in Japan for a year, so I think some of the etiquette was easier to adapt to compared to other students.

- Jess

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writingwithcolor

mary-queen-of-sluts asked:

Hello, I’m currently planning my English creative piece set in Arthurian times. One MC is black South African inspired thus her name is Melokuhle. I’ve listened to the pronunciation online and I realised that it would be hard for the other characters to pronounce. As they’re close should I keep it realistic and shorten her name to Mel or would that be a form of whitewashing? If it is, is it applicable to most names or just South African? Thank you for your time :)

writingwithcolor answered:

Character of Color with hard to pronounce name: How might they handle this? (”Melokuhle” as example)

I cannot verify if this is a proper name for her, but:

  1. Folks can learn how to say it.
  2. She shouldn’t be forced to offer a nickname / short version for the comfort of others. 

While yes, it does happen (people sometimes get tired of having a whole ordeal around pronouncing their name) it should not be the standard. 

Personal example:

My last name is Nigerian, and people rarely go in knowing how to pronounce it. I offer a careful, phonetic breakdown when:

  1. It’s mispronounced 
  2. Someone kindly goes out their way to ask how to properly pronounce it. 

They might not get it on the first couple tries, but that’s okay! I don’t mind repeating and trying to help them get it right. 

If it’s a very short encounter: I may not bother. But then again, this is my last name I’m talking about. As my first name, I would care that much more.  

For regular encounters: I would like folks to make the effort

I’ll let the other mods go into detail below!

~Mod Colette

Hold yer horses, OP. A couple things to clear up first. 

The Xhosa name Melokuhle

The name is not “South African.” It is Xhosa, which is one of Many languages spoken in South Africa. It concerns me that your level of research is so elementary that you didn’t know this, and that you’re using colonial national borders to assume some sort of standard. May I ask where you got the name to begin with? For future reference, baby name websites that clearly look like they were published from the US are not good sources to find non-English names or their meanings/origins. 

Many names out there, in their original forms, may be genuinely hard to pronounce for monolingual English speakers at first because their sounds or other suprasegmental elements (like tone) don’t exist in English. But generally there’s a range of forgiveness for sounds that simply don’t exist in the English inventory. Many people provide and are happy with “just good enough” alternatives that aren’t natively perfect, as long as the attempt is made seriously, it’s consistent, the name-haver’s wishes for pronunciation are respected, and it’s as close as possible to the original. And even then, if you have no disabilities around speech—with just a bit of practice, it’s really not that hard if you care to learn. 

Your character’s name Melokuhle, for example, is /melok’uɬe/ in broad IPA. I’ll discuss how easy all of the other sounds are in a different example below, but there are two sounds of note here. 

  • /k’/ is an ejective k, which means that pressurized air is coming out at the same time as the /k/ sound. In simple terms, think of it as constricting your throat as your tongue gets in the appropriate position, and then releasing as you actually make the sound, and it should create a kind of popping sound that sounds like a /k/ but more intense. You’ll notice a delay going into the next vowel, and that’s natural; while you make an ejective sound, your vocal cords (which are what really get shut in the “constriction”) can’t vibrate to make a voiced sound like a vowel. 
  • /ɬ/ is an alveolar lateral fricative, where the tongue configuration is the same as regular /l/ except turbulent air goes through in the same way that sounds like /s/, /z/, and /ʃ/ (“sh”) do. To English ears, it should in fact sound kind of similar to a “shh,” as the airstream mechanism is the same. 

Both non-English sounds described above can be achieved with a bit of coaching/study on where all the articulators in your mouth need to go. 

If the name in question is simply long, has atypical spelling conventions, or has unusual but pronounceable segmental combinations, the other person has no excuse. 

  • Eg. The Zulu name Sithembile in broad IPA is /sitʰembile/. The only thing to really keep in mind here is the spelling. The vowels are all tense vowels (think “ee” for /i/, “ayy” for /e/), and “th” refers to an aspirated /t/ sound, which is—surprise—exactly the same t sound as English.

In either situation, if abled people regularly mispronounce the name, give up, or ask for a shortening, it’s because they don’t care enough to give it some practice. 

~ Mod Rina

People should make the effort to learn

I have a name that is 4 letters, two syllables. It is spelled phonetically (as it sounds), and yet many white English speakers find it incredibly difficult to pronounce both correctly and consistently not because of the name itself, but because, as Rina and Colette say, people neither make the effort to learn nor practice. 

In the circles where I work, it is thankfully standard for an authority figure to ask for names and preferred pronunciations/ nicknames during introductions. There are some people who have difficulty with certain sounds (native English speakers and Japanese speakers seem to particularly struggle with names from other languages), but the SOP is to promise to learn the name and apologize when one makes a mistake. 

This is common courtesy in most global professional settings. Proper pronunciation of names is rather like misgendering for pronouns. Those who consider this to be indicative of civility will make an effort. Those who don’t won’t. So, the issue of the pronunciation rarely rests with an individual’s name, but rather the level of respect other people accord that individual.

- Marika.

Other characters asking for a nickname is a microaggression. 

The way people handle common mispronunciations of their name varies greatly. It also varies on the name. As much as I would love for everyone to be able to pronounce names, some sounds are hard for non native speakers of other languages. That’s where we get foreign accents.

All the sounds in my name exist in English, even if the combination of sounds are a little different than English, so I make people use my whole name if they are someone I will interact with regularly (coworkers, friends, etc.). I only use a shortened version of my name when ordering food. Meanwhile, many of my Chinese friends have English names or nicknames because the sounds in their names are difficult for English speakers and they get tired of hearing people butcher their names or walking people through the pronunciation.

Some people insist that people learn their names. Some have a nickname for daily use but teach friends and acquaintances their name. Some have nicknames or an English name. There is nothing wrong with any of these choices. The main issue is when people refuse to respect what someone wants to be called.

- SK

We would like to open this to any Xhosa followers.

writingwithcolor

Further Commentary

@epicmusic42 :

Not directly related to writing, but the point about other characters asking for a nickname being a microagression brought it to mind.

As someone with what is actually classified as a severe speech impediment (like. I was still in speech therapy my senior year of high school severe) I have noticed that whenever this gets brought up there’s only a passing acknowledgment of speech impediments at most. As a very white looking person, who sometimes literally can’t say people’s names, I would really love to hear some dialogue on how to handle that situation.

Like. Most speech impediments the average person will just hear as an accent. I regularly get away with mispronouncing English names because I have a drawl. I can literally count on one hand the number of people I’ve met who picked up on my speech impediment without being told and I’m in education and psych.

So if anyone has solutions or suggestions for how to ask for something I can pronounce without causing being a bit of a dick about it, I’d really love to hear them.

If you are involved in education in North American English speaking countries employing creative naming conventions for Western names or a country like the UK or Ireland where Gaelic is a common source for names, consider how you would socially handle a situation involving a student whose name is not phonetically spelled or cumbersome to say (On the scale of Shelagh to Paisleigh to X Æ A-12). The solution to the problem is the same.

- Marika.

I’m Deaf and I have a pretty obvious Deaf voice. I understand that it’s hard, but the main takeaway should be to try and be honest about where you’re struggling. If a person offers up a nickname after seeing someone have trouble, that’s different than suggesting your own. As I said in my original response, the main issue is when people refuse to respect what someone wants to be called.

- SK

Agreed. I’ve noticed widespread misconceptions from many people that asking is bad and perfection is expected. Continuing with the comparison to pronouns, it’s not the “getting it 100% right” that matters nearly as much as “I am clearly trying/ I’m not taking it for granted that your name should be altered for my convenience.“

- Marika.

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writingwithcolor

Should I bring up caste at all?

writingwithcolor

@scribeofthecodex said:

My question is if you’re writing an Indian American character for a story as a white writer, should you bring up the caste at all? I know surnames can tell what caste a character could come from, and have read news articles on how caste can follow a person even after immigration or even changing of religions, but it does sound like a case of ‘not my story to tell’ because it can be so complex and really easy to get wrong. So is it better not to talk about it or is erasure of important issues?

Whenever you write a white character, do you feel the need to discuss racism, even if the plot doesn’t involve social justice topics? If you don’t feel comfortable writing about casteism as a social issue, then don’t. It’s not something I’m comfortable writing about as a South Asian, definitely not something I’d recommend to a white writer who’s not prepared to do the hard work.

The main issues I see in South Asian characters is that non-scheduled castes are the most commonly represented, writers often portray the culture of non-scheduled castes as the only South Asian culture, and casteism in the writing itself.

When writing a character from a non-scheduled caste, I would keep those things in mind. I would be careful about casteism in the writing. Recognize that you aren’t breaking any barriers in this specific area.

Non-scheduled castes exist and make up a large part of the South Asian diaspora. There’s nothing wrong with writing characters from non-scheduled castes. However, casteism is primarily an intra-community issue and there’s nothing wrong with a South Asian character existing as a non-scheduled caste.

- SK

I think the advice of approaching writing Indians (particularly Hindus, and particularly Brahmin Hindus) as akin to writing about white people in the context of South Asia is helpful. More generally, this is about knowing that the existence of majority perspectives doesn’t make minority perspectives less valid or deserving of representation. It would be very exhausting if we devoted ourselves to discussing anti-caste and social justice topics all the time. Frankly, this is not a productive approach to a problem that spans millennia.

Depending on your setting, you can easily show caste diversity simply by how you name your characters. Someone growing up in Edison, New Jersey or a major American metropolitan area is likely to have many desi acquaintances from a variety of backgrounds. You can dodge the issue by making the story about children who are likely too young to be preoccupied by caste stereotypes or conflicts. Caste is a part of the identity of many desis, but it is a part, not the only part. Are race and nationality the only significant aspects of your own identity and character? If you aren’t comfortable addressing caste, simply seek a setting where caste is less relevant to your story. For me personally, pan-South Asian solidarity is more what I identified with in the US because many people I know experienced similar forms of discrimination and othering, particularly post-War on Terror. This isn’t to say casteism doesn’t happen in the US (See the Qualcomm incident), but for diaspora who grow up in the US, it can be easier to ID with people who share secular/ cultural aspects of life rather than focus on caste, religion and other divisions that are more relevant back home (Food, home life habits, where we shop, clothing, etc.).

To our desi followers, how do you feel about non-desi discussing caste? Do you feel this is an intra-community issue? Or one that can benefit from broader, global commentary? I believe the former (Having witnessed similar patterns of social stratification in Japan and the USA), but I also worry that many non-desi populations lack the education and appreciation for nuance needed to discuss this issue.

We request comments only from desi followers.

- Marika.

writingwithcolor

Reader Comments:

@mynameisriversong

:  I’m British Indian/Pakistani (mixed) and have a white co-writer on most of my projects and have asked that she does not bring it up. I am not comfortable sharing information about my caste especially since I am not fully indian.     

@a-green-bean:

i’m a brahmin atheist and i think bringing caste issues to the attention of people outside india is incredibly helpful, but i do not believe people who arent affected by the caste system should speak on it as an authority. its still an intra-community issue.   

@cookiesaresquishy

:

I’m desi (indian), and I have many friends who are desi, and honestly caste has never ever been something we talk about. i’m sure to some american desis caste is a big thing, but most i’ve met have never brought it up. i myself talked about it only a little with my parents, but thats it. since i think im from a decent(?) caste, i cant speak for others from lower/higher, but it barely holds a thought in my mind. I do not think you need to include castes as an explicit topic in your book at all. BUT i do think showing desis with different names as they are from different castes is good!! as you are white, it doesn’t sit right with me if you are trying to give your opinion on castes (as in, writing anti-caste stories or something). im very anti-caste myself, and i think that conversation should be led by desis. in the end, i dont think you really need to mention caste to have a fully-fleshed out indian american character. if you want to show connection to india or a disconnect between being american and indian, there are plenty more ways to do that.    

I think what’s interesting about your comment is that it does reveal how caste privilege persists within diaspora. You are aware that you are from a “decent” caste, but it’s not something you are made to worry about. However, I agree that think context is important. A story of desi children sharing a music or dance class, or a story about growing up in American suburbia  is going to have a very different tinge w/r to caste than a story about a young adult exploring their desi identity.       

@tobermoriansass

:

I think if someone’s going to include/comment on caste in a story then they have to be prepared to go all the way and delve through the material that’s been put together by dalit diaspora abroad to understand how caste plays out across multiple dimensions of, especially, Dalit Indians’ lives in the diaspora (which are frankly invisible to upper caste folks). Thenmozhi Soundarajan’s work along w Equality Labs would be a good starting point.

Agreed. I would like to see broader awareness of casteism in diaspora communities. I find that Thenmozhi Soundarajan offers a valuable perspective in terms of showing replication of caste structure in the USA. The Brahmin diaspora intransigence towards affirmative action is a great demonstration of this tendency, as is Brahmin resistance in acknowledging anti-blackness. Where I remain unsure is whether I want this discussion in the hands of white people who are often ignorant of how much Western proxies like class and race cloud their own perceptions of reality.

@dulaari

: I dunno. I don’t think it would be erasure at all not to discuss for a diaspora character - it’s not as if Indian-Americans spend all day thinking about caste, and I wouldn’t think it was strange if it never came up. However, I could easily see caste being brought up in a forced way and making the representation less believable overall. Unless you put in a LOT of research, might be best to avoid.

This is a good point. I always think it best for the author to consider their comfort level and ability to handle this type of story.

- Marika

user commentary mod commentary Desi caste politics caste South Asia wwc
writingwithcolor

How much research to do for minor Characters of Color?

writingwithcolor

@lun4rc0w said:

I know that doing a whole hecking lot of research if you’re writing a major character who is POC is important, but what about minor characters? I don’t mean to sound dismissive I’m just not sure if you should read a whole book or something to write a character who has a very small role.

Why Research is Important

I’m curious why, as a writer, you would want to write about characters from backgrounds with which you are not familiar if you have no interest in doing the research? Research helps us write about foreign topics by giving us the appropriate context needed to ground characters and settings, making their presence in the plot and interactions with other characters compelling. I don’t mean to sound dismissive, but is it reasonable for an audience to invest in a story if the writer can’t be bothered to care whether or not the average individual finds the story worth reading? 

Please excuse my blunt response, but I wanted to make a point. As a consumer of media, I can easily tell when a creator cares enough to try and capture my attention, as I’m sure you can as well. Poor research creates dissonance, which disrupts your audience’s ability to engage with your work.

Let’s remove race/ ethnicity/ culture from the equation and look at this problem from a different angle. Many popular works in different genres of literature (Mystery, fantasy, sci-fi, historical fiction) live or die by their technical accuracy, often requiring copious research. Think of researching diverse characters as another form of accuracy but for societies, norms and social concepts as opposed to physics, warfare or forensics.

If you find that the amount of work needed to research a particular character is exceeding what you are willing to do, I think there are several approaches.

  1. If a character is minor enough that their background has no relevance to the plot, setting or other characters, they probably can be eliminated. Remember: poor representation is often the greater sin.
  2. If the research needed for a particular background is too tiresome, perhaps the background can be changed to something more accessible. There is no shame in not being ready to integrate diversity into your writing at a rapid speed. Take your time.
  3. Just write for yourself. Never share your work. Store your works in a secret room hidden behind a bookcase.

- Marika.

writingwithcolor

ree-fireparrot said:

I’m not the asker but I did once think of a story where it wouldn’t make sense for only people from cultures I’m familiar with to get involved (global crisis type thing). Maybe it’s a similar situation with the asker, where you have a larger number of roles than cultures you have time to research?

I’m also wondering if there’s a distinction between a background detail that happens to be a person vs a minor character. Ex. a group of diplomats whose names are briefly mentioned in the news but never actually appear vs the local teacher that the POV character briefly works with for the one chapter that he’s in Brazil.

Here is where the term “sufficient research” is key. I would still argue that sufficient research is needed in the above scenario. You would need to have a sense of the following aspects of your involved cultures even for very casual references.

  • Names
  • Languages
  • Educational structure of the country/ Governmental titles and political structure of the country

Let’s imagine if I were to take the above approach with a story set in a European setting, mixing time periods, aspects of historical dress, languages (including for conlangs) and social structure (Japanese manga and light novel do this regularly for non-Japanese cultures, much to my chagrin). Many white/ Western/ European readers would point out that my research is lacking. Heck, there’s a whole branch of YouTube that picks apart historical accuracy of Western dress for the movie/ TV industry (Beautifully skewered by this A Bit Fry and Laurie sketch). Thus, the same logic should apply to depictions of non-white/ non-Western cultures and their associated individuals. Will I need to read a whole book? Probably not. Will I likely spend the same amount of time on research as if I had read a whole book? Probably.

I recognize that research for new writers is daunting and time-consuming. It takes time to become proficient at efficiently locating the desired information. However, I believe that it is important that authors who wish to share their work in a public setting be held to the same standard no matter what cultures they are drawing from and which characters they are presenting to the reader.

- Marika.

user commentary mod commentary research WWC
writingwithcolor

Japanese name check, also concerns with Smart Asian and Colored Hair tropes

writingwithcolor

@theoldgodsarealiveandbitching submitted:

Hey there, I’m working on a fantasy story where one of the girls who forms the starting cast is a Japanese-Canadian girl, and she’s a third-generation Canadian. I know it’s more common for second and third-generation immigrants to have Western first names, but I’d love to use the name Tomoko Sato for her as the meaning really suits. In terms of justification, her primary caretaker is her grandmother, who is a fashion designer that built a business off a fashion house that incorporates traditional Japanese fashion elements into their designs. I think it would make a lot of sense for her to push back against the pressure to assimilate.

As well, I’m worried about her falling into the Smart Asian trope, as she isn’t particularly great at school (her ADHD makes classroom learning hard), but she likes accruing knowledge and has a super broad knowledge base from cycling through hyper-fixations. She’s excellent at thinking at her feet and has a few moments throughout the story where she invents unique solutions or puts together things before the rest of the cast. She and her Nigerian-Canadian friend and love interest work together on a journal of their experiences throughout as well, with her providing the writing and him doing illustrations, though that plot line can easily be scrapped if the urge on her part to observe and document seems unnatural or forced. 

Lastly, she regularly colours her hair a platinum blonde colour. It doesn’t have a huge significance behind it besides her liking the aesthetic and enjoying it as a form of self-expression. Do you think it runs the risk of encroaching on the “Asian girl with coloured hair” trope? Thanks in advance!

WWC Commentary on Asians with Hair Streaks 

~ Mod Rina

The protagonist’s name is a little generic and old-fashioned (Think Jane Smith). There is nothing wrong with her name, but it might be nice to think about why she has the name that she does. I know my share of Nikkei acquaintances who are named for older relatives and thus have names that are more common in previous eras. 

I wouldn’t worry too much about the Smart Asian trope. You have concisely stated many characteristics of people with ADHD who manage to succeed in academic settings despite their limitations simply because coping skills and hyperfixation make up the difference (Also known as How Marika Got a 5 in AP US History Without Studying). Remember: tropes and stereotypes are tools. They aren’t meant to be avoided part and parcel, but rather used in moderation when they can result in more compelling narratives.

- Marika

writingwithcolor

@pens-swords-stuff

said:

I would also add, I don’t think you need to feel like you need to justify your character’s Japanese name @theoldgodsarealiveandbitching! I’m a second generation Japanese American, and my full name is extremely Japanese, and I don’t have a middle name either. I fully plan on naming my children if I ever have any with Japanese names as well — not because I’m pushing back against assimilation, or any other reason like that. Simply, my language and my culture are really important important part of me, and I want to pass that onto my future family. As far as I’m aware, my parents didn’t even consider giving me an English name because assimilation just never occurred to them despite immigrating to America.

I have several people in my community who have Western names, middle names, names that can be both Western and Japanese, people who have two names… So your mileage will definitely vary but it is definitely realistic for a third generation immigrant to have a Japanese name simply because their parents wanted to give them one.

Why we think naming matters

We brought up the issue of justification simply because the first name itself is rather old-fashioned. Like any other culture, Japanese names have trends, and while, say, Bertha is a perfectly fine name, it is not as common today as it may have been in previous decades. Thus, it seems logical for there to be a reason as to why the character has the name they do.

We also think it’s important to remember that there is a difference between how we, Shin-Nikkei, view our relationship with Japanese identity and culture versus more established Nikkei Americans and Canadians (Sansei and upward) have as the result of the historic trauma of internment and subsequent pressures to assimilate or, conversely, tendencies towards increased conservatism and Japanese nationalism, increased sensitivity to cultural appropriation, etc.

For many pre-war Nikkei families, giving a child a Japanese name is a conscious choice, and has the consequence of making the child stand out in comparison to their white counterparts. Shin-Issei parents are more likely unconcerned with extreme forms of discrimination, though there are exceptions (immigrants from the Toyota years in the 80s were particularly sensitive to hate crimes).

Both Rina and I have distinctly Japanese names (that is, Japanese names that work for both of our respective cultures) because our Japanese mothers, being more recent immigrants, thought “Yeah, what’s the harm?” We expect this would be doubly so for a child with parents who were both recent immigrants from Japan.

However, in more established Nikkei communities, the optics are often different. For example, in LA, lots of Nikkei folks camouflage Japanese identity by using the child’s Japanese name as their middle name. Names that “sound” Western are also pretty popular (E.g. Naomi because most people assume it’s Jewish; or Ken, which can be used as a nickname for a variety of Japanese names, but is assumed by most white people to mean Kenneth). This also applies to Nikkei children who are multiracial where name-blending may be less about intentional culture-blending as our names are. Thus, for a Sansei Japanese- Canadian, we think it is more likely for there to be a distinct reason her to have the name she does.

- Marika and Rina

japan japanese character nikkei nikkei character names user commentary mod commentary Japanese names asks asian colored hair

Clarification on Previous Ask: Yokai and Cultural Relevancy

@tommy-talks submitted:

Hi, writingwithcolor,

I saw a post here: https://writingwithcolor.tumblr.com/post/634627583386042368/worldbuilding-with-yokai-original-yokai

And I wanted to ask a question regarding those new to employing diversity.

What did the mods mean by those reaching for “low hanging fruit (Japanese and Jewish cultures)” due to nervousness/newness to employing diversity?

Does this mean that writers are resorting to writing cultures that they’re more familiar with, or is it more like, writing cultures that they may have more positive/philo-like biases toward in the first place (e.g. philosemitism vs. more obviously bad bias against cultures that aren’t “low hanging fruit”).

In the above context, I was referring to writing about cultures with which the writer is more familiar. In my opinion, Judaism is often more familiar to people who grew up in Western environments dominated by cultural Christianity. I similarly think Japanese culture is perceived by many Western audiences as more familiar because of how pervasive our pop culture is on a global level compared to other non-white cultures.

- Marika. 

ask follow-up mod commentary user question
writingwithcolor

Secret society of immortal Japanese demon hunters in Japan

writingwithcolor

endersrayne asked:

After scouring the #japanese and #mythology for weeks. I think I have the strength to ask my question.

I have a story that can be summarized as “secret society of immortal Japanese demon hunters in Japan”. The immortality comes from eating the demons. This practice is like “Sin eating”. I think they see their bodies as “filters” and doing a (spiritual) service for their country. The demons are normally born from emotions but there is also a hell.

In the macros, every known country has their version of “secret demon hunter” and methods of exorcism. I had the demon eater aspect be apart of various cultures throughout east Asian regions. However if that hits any no-no’s I can gladly drop that point.

I saw in a tagged post that the “Japanese bad boy” is an insensitive topic. I was confused as to why but if that’s the case I feel that my deuturagonist could fall into this category. He is bonded to the protagonist, an African-American expat who is a big anime fangirl. As he navigates his relationship with her, he confronts his family’s plus his own views on race and other-ism. Eventually he’ll have a “rebel” reputation. This is not to glorify the “bad boy”. He also happens to like rocker culture but his choices aren’t influenced by it. Let me know any issues.

World-building and Religious Incompatibility

Rina will handle the latter part of your ask, but I have some comments about your world-building. Demons, exorcisms and purification in Japan culturally fall under the purview of Shinto, Shinto-Buddhist syncretism and indigenous shamanism. Thus, these would be the philosophies that would influence any school of demon hunting. However, there are culturally Christian elements to your world-building that don’t quite make sense to me in the contexts of these religions. 

  1. The view of demons as creatures needing to be hunted: In Buddhism, demons serve a purpose. They test people, either towards temptation or to help them eradicate moral impurity. Within Shinto, evil and uncleanliness manifest less from malignant forces and more from the stagnancy and traumas that we humans create through our thoughts and actions. 
  2. The use of Christianity-specific terminology like “sin” or “hell.” There are hells in both Shinto and Buddhism. The former, however, is more like the underworld in Greek mythology. For the latter, it’s more like a purgatory where souls work off bad karma (and this is more specifically for esoteric Buddhism). I think comparing exorcism and purification to filtration is actually not bad, but rest feels off. 
  3. The immortality. Immortality in Japan is generally thought of as unnatural. A side effect of being a country full of volcanoes on the Rim of Fire in the Pacific (In addition to fun things like typhoons) is that death and renewal are a constant reality. Key aspects of Japanese culture are about appreciating that things are precious because they are impermanent. Immortality makes this appreciation difficult. 
  4. This last point is not religion related, but you say they demon hunters perform this service as “a (spiritual) service for their country.” This, and other parts of your description, imply one Japanese religion and the existence of a unified Japanese people. This is harmful because Shinto-backed Yamato supremacy has been used for over 200 years to justify the oppression and genocide of Ainu and Ryukyuan communities. Leaving aside religious diversity, Japan has historically had at least 3 major indigenenous ethnicities, several major immigrant communities and 1 officially labeled underclass. Whose interests do this organization really serve? Under whose orders? And for which religion? Which sect?

Essentially, your problem is a lot like when JK Rowling writes her version of wizardry for any country besides the UK. She can write one part of the world very well, but as soon as she extrapolates her world-building to countries and cultures where she lacks competency, she moves towards stereotypes and oversimplification at the expense of those cultures. Trying to distill any single culture, let alone a country, into a representative organization is a mammoth task even for someone who knows what they are doing.

Possible Solutions

I have 2 possible suggestions for world-building, both for Japan and the macroscopic view to reduce this risk of poor representation:

  1. Instead of trying to come up with an overgeneralized secret organization for each country with all members practicing the same techniques or following the same underlying religious/ spiritual principles is to simply come up with individual characters from a variety of backgrounds. Then, think of a more secular organizational structure appropriate for each country that would allow these individuals to participate (Ex. A board of directors, a cooperative, a league, etc.).
  2. Move away from urban fantasy to straight fantasy. This would allow you greater creative freedom. Set your demon hunter story in a world where you use coding to adapt and combine the specific elements of a Japanese culture that appeal to you with other culture(s) to create something more original that has a variety of cultural influences, but doesn’t run the risk of resulting in poor representation for a single culture because it will be uniquely it’s own.

Either way, I see more research in your future.

- Marika.

“Bad Boy Deuteragonist”

With regards to your deuteragonist, I figure you mean this post I wrote on fetishization. And uh, I never said that Japanese “bad boys” are an insensitive topic, rather that the idea of the villified, exoticized Japanese man was an Old Hollywood trope that goes to show that Japanese men were fetishized in the context of their foreignness. Ask yourself:

When I used the term “bad boy” in that post, was I really referring to the leather-jacket wearing delinquent type (which has its own Japanese media stereotypes FYI)? Or was I cheesily referring to the brooding, taboo, “exotic” Asian lover archetype of silent film, in the context of Sessue Hayakawa’s biography? (hint: it’s the latter)

Did I not say that this archetype was pretty much a dead trope, because it was situated in the context of mid-century American taboo of interracial relationships? (hint: I did) 

Please read the Sessue Hayakawa biography I linked to in that post, and perhaps you will be less confused. 

That being said, I still do see some potential for exoticization as-is, completely unrelated to his punk-rocking. I feel the need to point out that your “anime fangirl” protagonist is just as at risk of fetishizing her boyfriend as if she were white. Being a different kind of POC does not absolve one of fetishization against East Asians. You may want to rethink that label altogether, and critically examine in what way your protag is an “anime fangirl.”

How do Japanese people feel about non-Japanese anime fans?

A quick poll among my Japanese peers shows that:

  • While over 90% of respondents were good with dating someone who enjoyed manga/anime (Provided they didn’t refer to themselves as a “weeb,” “otaku,” or “anime fangirl/boy…”)
  • …Only ~20% of respondents were good with dating someone who unironically used the above labels. 
  • Most people who responded in the negative said they may be convinced to go on a first date, but wouldn’t expect much, with one respondent noting that they would be significantly on edge. 
  • That being said! A few respondents commented that they were willing to give BIPOC more benefit of the doubt, citing the alt-right hostility of many white-dominated weeb circles which they believed would keep many anime-consuming BIPOC out of the most harmful influences/communities. Even then, their willingness to date weeb/otaku/fangirl/boy BIPOC was rated as “neutral.”

This goes to show that, for the sake of the English-speaking Japanese people reading your story (Aka Nikkei people who care about representation) you should diminish the fangirl aspect of your protagonist, and just make her love of anime incidental. Make it so that your Japanese guy is neutral with respect to your protagonists’s interests, rather than, say, flattered that she’s “interested in his culture” or anything like that. Similarly, bonding over some mutual obsession of anime would be cringy and voyeuristic, not in the sense that it’s unrealistic (Japanese people like anime too!), but in the sense that it plays too readily into what Westerners (Particularly weeaboos) may expect. 

Confrontations with family

As for the way he confronts his and his family’s views on race, it’s unclear whether you mean the racism he experiences, or the racism the Black protagonist experiences. If we had more info, we could help you. Just consider these basic facts and make of them what you will:

  • Yamato Japanese people are the dominant group and all other ethnicities are minorities; think of racism in terms of who is considered the Other, and who is systematically favored. 
  • Anti-blackness in Japan is a big issue, but also one where Black residents of Japan, Black Japanese, and Black Nikkei should have their voices prioritized. Are you one of these groups? What issues will you cover? If you are non-black, are you getting consultation? Are you overstepping? 

You have quite a bit of cultural researching to do. Good luck. 

~Mod Rina

writingwithcolor

@resplendentgoldenwings:

But what about Devil Hunter Yoko and Inu Yasha and the long list of animes that feature demon hunting protags?

@what-hos-there:

those are all properties written by JAPANESE PEOPLE about THEIR OWN CULTURE, so that’s not the same kettle of fish at all. You can mess with your own culture as much as you want and you’ll never be wrong, but poking outside of it can be a landmine for the oblivious and a whole dang minefield for people of that origin culture who see their lives and history being done insensitively.

This is exactly correct! Think of being a part of a culture like gaining constant experience for a skill that allows you to determine what is important for that culture and what is less important, what is more crucial to legitimacy and what is less crucial.

In healthcare and development, we call the ability to both understand the perspective of people from a particular cultural background and translate their perspectives into effective action “cultural competency.” I find that this is an apt metaphor in writing circles as well. Imagine an content creator with high cultural competency writing on a topic through a lifetime of cultural immersion. Now imagine someone without that skill. Who do you think will produce content that will resonate more widely with audiences?

Many writers who write to us asking about a particular setting or character frankly lack the cultural competency to approach the stories they wish to write because they have no familiarity with the cultures they seek to depict. When I think of the authors whose stories strike me as culturally competent, they fall into 2 categories:

  1. Those who write what they know
  2. Those who write after accumulating a lifetime of experiences, research and observations necessary to better understand people who come from dissimilar upbringings.

As the founding moderators at WWC are fond of saying, writing with diversity is a marathon, not a sprint. We try and offer advice to save you some time, but there is no way to avoid the bulk of the work that has to be done by the writer on their own.

- Marika.

Japan Japanese character demon hunter religion cultural Christianity worldbuilding secret societies fantasy Black protagonist fetishization interracial romance interracial relationships user commentary mod commentary antiblackness
hilaritatis

Indian-Scottish character practicing Hinduism from boarding school

writingwithcolor

@viola-cola said:

I have a half-Indian, half-Scottish character named Niraj Ajit Sonar (Ajit being his father’s name) born in Scotland. His father is Marathi and immigrated to Scotland, while his mother is white. I’m mostly confident this name makes sense, but thought I should check anyway. My primary concern with this character is showing that he is a practicing Hindu when the story takes place in a boarding school. Beyond him going home for certain important holidays, how might he practice on a daily basis?

The Obvious:

  • If he’s had a thread ceremony, you could show that he wears it under his clothes at all times. Many Hindu boys tend to have a thread ceremony performed before they are 16. 
  • He might be used to taking his shoes off in his dorm room, as many diaspora South Asians do at home (The American/ British habit of wearing shoes at home still puzzles me to this day, given their preference for carpeting). 

The Less Obvious:

  • Whether or not he chooses to be vegetarian depends on his personal convictions, his family and also his assimilation within the UK, but as a Brahmin who openly consumes and prepares beef, even I have a certain level of guilt about consuming beef, so that’s another cue that communal dining in boarding schools might offer. I can imagine lots of family tension around meals at home where the father has issues with beef that the mother’s family just doesn’t understand (This is heavily pulled from my own life). I’ve made the mistake of almost eating beef in front my Hindu relatives when they come to visit and oof.
  • Sonar/ Sunar is a goldsmithing last name, so it might be fun to have relatives back in India sending him jewelry (like gold chains) or metal statues of Ganesha or Saraswati (For luck and studies) that he debates over bringing to school. It’s very typical for South Asian relatives who can afford it to send gold jewelry to favored children as gold is perceived as protective in many South Asian cultures. More practically, gold is a highly liquid asset in India. Explaining to my family that I couldn’t possibly wear the elaborate jewelry they sent me in a Western environment or the risks of displaying a sterling silver statue of Ganesha in my dorm room was a particular struggle growing up, but in this case, it could serve as a subtle nod to his caste background as well. In my case, I abandoned the silver Ganesha statue, but I did keep a prayer altar in my room that I offered incense to on a regular basis. Thankfully, my roommates had no issue, but California is also very strict about the protection of religious expression.

Coding Hinduism in British Environments

I think the best way to code his Hinduism is frankly to explore the tensions that  the climate of traditional Briish boarding schools/ Oxford/ Cambridge type can provoke for people from former colonies. This struggle strikes me as largely consistent with his Scottish/ Gaelic roots, particularly if he grew up speaking any form of Scots. For all the social mobility opportunities they offer, British boarding schools present real challenges to a person engaged with their non-British heritage. He’ll hear a lot of views on colonialism and his father’s culture (arranged marriages, dietary restrictions, stereotypes, pro-British sentiment, etc.) that directly conflict with his parents’ relatives’ stances in borderline offensive ways (Particularly for the Indian side). Even geography lessons could be a potential trigger. Starting from when I was a kid, states like Maharashtra started replacing the British names for regions and cities with their pre-British names (Did anyone wonder why Bombay, Madras and Calcutta became Mumbai, Chennai and Kolkata overnight?). 

I recommend talking to people of mixed desi heritage living in the UK about their experiences with British racism and xenophobia. Tiktok has a lot of great “POC at Hogwarts” clips that skewer British parochialism with great flair.

- Marika.

He might practice by praying to an idol he brought with him, or wear an elephant necklace. It doesn’t have to be an expensive metal, for the reasons that Marika mentioned. That’s what my dad would do. Mom says he would get up at five AM every day and pray while working as an oncologist.

- Jaya

hilaritatis

You need to think about when your story is set.

If it’s set now, most boarding schools offer vegetarian and vegan food, and lots of people have those options for reasons other than religion, so it wouldn’t stand out much. Also, geography classes now will use Mumbai etc.
Even 20 years ago, you’d get veggie food, though people might comment on it more. You’d probably learn the British names for Indian cities - but equally, it’s not like we studied India much. Even posh boarding schools largely adhered to the National Curriculum from the mid-90s onwards, even if they extended beyond it, and Japan was one of the main countries studied.
One place where being Hindu would stand out is in compulsory worship. Many boarding schools are explicitly religious and have their own chapels. So everyone else troops off to Chapel in the morning, and he’s probably sent to sit in a room doing make-work with all the other people who objected to the compulsory religion.

writingwithcolor

I think temporality is a great note! Certainly, the experiences of my relatives who attended boarding school in earlier decades differ from what I imagine would be more standard now. I do have some notes, nevertheless.

  • Students who eat differently or behave differently are othered for the simple fact that they are behaving in ways that their classmates don’t, particularly if existing mores don’t approve of that reason (e.g. A food allergy is acceptable. Religious observance is considered disruptive).
  • Do not underestimate the inflexibility of super-majority climates, particularly when assimilation is encouraged (Boarding schools are institutions, after all). The tyranny of the majority is very real and insidious.

In short, while there’s no need for this to be a modern-day Dickensian horror story on boarding schools (In fact, I recommend showing numerous instances of triumph and empowerment!), I expect the boarding school aspect will resonate more authentically with desi and mixed race readers if you avoid a Mallory Towers/ St. Clare’s/ Harry Potter type story that pretends the interaction between the environment and your character’s identity doesn’t affect them.

Desi Desi character Indian Scottish Mixed Race Hindu Hinduism racism colonialism boarding schools user commentary mod commentary
untransliterated

Curse Involving Limb and Organ Regrowth - Associations with Hindu Gods?

writingwithcolor

@reine-des-pres asked:

Hi there! My character was cursed to constantly grow new organs, bones and muscles, and one of her main goal is finding a way to stop it. She’s half-Indian, Bengali to be exact, and very close to her culture. I’m worried that readers will associate her curse with hindu gods because of the multiple limbs factor.

It’s absolutely not my intention. Neither her father nor her are hindu, and she gets her “growths” surgically taken out before they can develop into fully formed limbs. While she does have special abilities, the curse has nothing to do with it and she mostly sees it as a dangerous medical condition. Are there still things I should be mindful about? Or would it be better to change her ethnicity entirely? Thank you for your time. 

A Note on Religious Iconography

Limb generation and multiple arms/ heads are not exclusively a Hindu or Indian trope. Many religions practiced throughout Asia use this feature in their iconography. I think the basic idea is “More hands/ heads = More able to help/ More able to observe”. One variation of a myth about Brahma has him growing an extra head to better view the beauty of his wife from any angle (If memory serves, she didn’t appreciate this and hid herself). Another key thing to remember is that regeneration in myths is not equated to growing a limb for a specific purpose (Ex. The bodhisattva Avalokitesvara growing 1000 arms in Buddhist myths to more easily reach sufferers).

You don’t specify religion for your character here, which would make a big difference. Even a non-religious Indian person is likely to be culturally whatever religion their family is from. You will have readers who will make the kind of associations with Hinduism you are worried about, but that’s on their bias, not yours. Your responsibility is to your world-building, plot and characters so the story can stand on its own. To that end, you’ll need to make sure that you aren’t taking lazy shortcuts with respect to stereotyping and shoddy research. If the prospect of an angry horde of indignant readers scares you, I recommend finding a qualified S. Asian sensitivity reader to help you navigate which faction in S. Asia your story is most likely to piss off.

Medical Logistics?

Now, about her condition: The logistics are not quite clear to me. Is she constantly growing excess organs and limbs? Regrowing damaged ones? At what speed? At what speed do the new growths have to be removed? From what I’ve confirmed with people I know in medicine, I imagine she would be just constantly recovering from various surgeries, and that sounds very miserable.

Perils of Anguish-based Narratives

Forget offensive by Hindu/ Indian standards. I’m just personally bored with stories where the brown person suffers unless you can make it feel less…icky. 

I admit, I’m not enthused by this question because it brings up all sorts of parallels to stories of parasitic twins who are put on display/ worshipped in rural India. The girl referenced by Jaya below had to go into hiding to stay safe from a traveling circus that wanted to put her on display. Having a parasitic twin is very hard on a person’s body. The parasitic limbs and organs consume nutrients the main body needs, so perhaps you’d better research the pathology and consider just how hard you’d like to make your protagonist’s life.

- Marika.

Reminders on S. Asian Incidents Involving Parasitic Twins

I’m going to refer you to my answer about if a character who gives herself four extra limbs should be Indian/ Hindu or not. There are a lot of cultural implications and there have been with four-limbed girls.

My recommendation is no because an Indian person with extra limbs may be worshiped or exploited within a Hindu context. That’s what happened to a real girl named Lakshmi Tatma, who had a parasitic twin.

- Jaya

reine-des-pres

(I thought the comment function would appear on my blog, but I guess not? I haven’t been on Tumblr in months, sorry about that!)

First, thank you for the thorough answer! To clarify, her arc isn’t centered around her curse, it’s just an aspect of her. She’s the protagonist’s 24 year old half-sister, a powerful magic user and a central character to the plot. I didn’t want to bog the ask in detail, as the curse is the only detail I was worried about 😅 

About the medical aspect. My father has been chronically ill since I was very young, and I used to believe he had been “cursed by a witch” when I was small since I didn’t understand what was happening or why. So the symptoms this character has and the way her family treats her mirrors the way my family was growing up, though with a fantasy twist. As in, it’s accepted that she has good and bad days, and her condition is just a normal part of the family life.

The only time this character is in severe pain is when she doesn’t take care of herself and her condition properly. Otherwise, about every month or so, she just needs to take pain medication and visit a friend specializing in healing magic who removes the excess organs/bones before they grow big enough to cause problems. If she’s careful, it’s mostly just an annoyance to her. 

Hopefully this helps to provide some context. But regardless, thank you for the advice, I’ll change her background to avoid bad implications. Would a Sri Lankan and Buddhist family background still be too close for comfort? As in, is the association still going to be uncomfortable no matter what if she is of South Asian descent?

writingwithcolor

First, OP, I empathize. My dad developed non-Hodgkins Lymphoma when I was five and too willfully oblivious to understand what was going on at home. It sucks when you get old enough to understand. Sympathies for your dad as well. Second, why not give the sister leukemia instead of a curse, and have her in remission while the family is potentially facing medical debt? It’s more acceptable because we Indians get cancer too and would avoid any issues with the growing arms implications that we have discussed.

If going this route, however, assuming there are magical treatments equivalent to chemotherapy and surgery, make sure there is no magical cure for cancer. No one likes a cure narrative unless it’s on Fullmetal Alchemist levels with story quality and a price to pay. I can tell that your dad having cancer has weighed on your life and impacted it.

- Jaya

This is clearly a personal issue, but to echo Jaya, I don’t think this curse is an effective chronic illness/ cancer metaphor. I don’t think changing the character’s religion, nationality or ethnicity will improve this curse in the South Asian context. What specifically bothers me is that your portrayal of the sister seems to unrealistically minimize her pain and her family’s awareness of her pain in ways that don’t resonate on a cultural level, particularly with what I know of living with cancer, and my own experiences with chronic pain. My aunt has blood cancer, and while we became acclimated to her condition, we were always aware of what she is going through. You have to understand that in developing countries, health is a major source of concern and tension. Because of the strong stigma against cancer in South Asia, we actively chose to not sensationalize her condition, but even nonverbal support and awareness can effectively highlight the reality of life for a patient with chronic illness.

Your description of your experience with your father conveys heroic efforts to preserve a sense of normalcy. However, I think you must take care to draw the distinction between normalization of pain versus trivializing pain. A person’s suffering can be an unobtrusive fact of life but still have great significance. I bring this up because non-verbal support, active family involvement and compassionate awareness are important behaviors in many Asian cultures, including those in South Asia. If I had a sibling with a painful, chronic illness/ curse, it would be expected that I would accompany them to their treatments unless they specifically objected. You say that your character manages her condition well. However, in a collectivist culture, a person who is ill is very likely to overextend, which is precisely why their family would be on high alert to help them manage their condition. Life would eventually settle into a new normal, but the illness would still play a significant role in the family’s day-to-day life.

- Marika.

reine-des-pres

Those are all very interesting points. The one about normalization versus trivialization especially resonate, I’ll be mindful about that. I’ll rework the effects and mechanics of the curse for sure.

I didn’t convey it very well in my post, but the sister character is mixed. Her mother is a white woman from a fictional country based on Ancient Rome, and her father is South Asian. They divorced when she was a child, dad got full custody and they moved to her father’s home country after that. The story takes place when she is an adult and moves back in with her mother, who remarried with a Bosniak man and had a new child by him (which is our protagonist). We mainly see the sister interact with the white side of her family, but I’ll definitely keep your advice in mind for how she’d interact with them or how her South Asian relatives would react to her condition.

Thank you for all the work that you do. I hope that you and your loved ones can be as well as is possible. 

untransliterated

I know this is a conversation between @reine-de-pres and @writingwithcolor, and I hope it’s okay that I’m adding this—if the mods of @writingwithcolor want me to delete this I will. I’m not South Asian (and not attempting any commentary on your portrayal of a South Asian character) but I am chronically ill, and I just want to highlight this sentence:

“The only time this character is in severe pain is when she doesn’t take care of herself and her condition properly.”

I just want to caution that as a sick person I have spent a lot of time fending off the notion that every time my symptoms flare up, it’s because of something I did wrong. That I’m failing to manage my condition properly. Sometimes it’s true that I missed a dose of meds or didn’t eat enough or pushed myself too hard—but a huge percentage of the time it’s not. Sometimes my body just decides to go haywire. Ultimately, being sick is an exercise in not being in control over your body. You don’t decide what happens to you. The world—friends, family, doctors, and everything you see when you turn on the TV or open a book— tells you that if you just did everything right, the problem would go away, and so you feel like you’re going crazy when you do everything right and the problem keeps coming. It’s one of the more pernicious aspects of how contemporary dominant culture conceives of illness.

I know you’re summarizing for the purposes of a conversation about an entirely different aspect of your story, and I’m not trying to condemn or even really criticize you for your wording in this post. I just wanted to suggest that whatever direction you take this story, you keep this in mind. If you’re inventing a magical illness from scratch, you have a lot of control over what you do with it, and what message it communicates about illness in general. The downside is you don’t have a real illness that you can research and consult first-person testimonies about. I’d invite you to double-check that when you finish crafting your fantasy curse, your story isn’t saying “Whenever sickness gets worse, it’s because of a failure on the part of the sick person.”

writingwithcolor

This is also an excellent point. I would also add that much of how the family’s interaction with curse was initially described seemed very much like a portrayal of illness from the perspective of someone who is not chronically ill, and thus unaware that many people with chronic illness make an active effort to appear ok when they are suffering. However, as the author, you are aware of multiple character perspectives, not just one. The contrast between how this sister character views her own experience and her non-South Asian family’s relative nonchalance is useful information because it will inform how the two parties interact.

I say the above because I think the mixed nature of the sister’s identity and upbringing actually further complicates her situation. Due to the influence of Buddhism, many South Asian cultures treat the state of suffering is a universal constant. This is where the cultural dimensions of compassionate awareness come into play. If this character is raised in an environment that emphasizes such values and then moves somewhere where those values are not necessarily prioritized, there would be dissonance between what she internally expects and how she is treated by family. I don’t mean to say that her mother’s family is treating her callously, but rather that her mixed experience would likely lead to different expectations of how her condition would be handled by people she loves and trusts. Speaking personally as a mixed person with chronic illness, that would be very stressful, and likely aggravate my illness (As stress does for most people with chronic illness). As a reader, I don’t think much of the sister’s characterization would resonate with me in its current iteration. I believe this character would benefit from sensitivity reading input from perspectives that include South Asian culture, living with chronic illness and mixed race experiences.

- Marika.

south asia south asian character india indian characters surgery tw body horror tw parasitic twins asks lakshmi tatma mod commentary user commentary chronic illness chronic pain mixed experiences long post
meadow-morning-deactivated20220

Curse Involving Limb and Organ Regrowth - Associations with Hindu Gods?

writingwithcolor

@reine-des-pres asked:

Hi there! My character was cursed to constantly grow new organs, bones and muscles, and one of her main goal is finding a way to stop it. She’s half-Indian, Bengali to be exact, and very close to her culture. I’m worried that readers will associate her curse with hindu gods because of the multiple limbs factor.

It’s absolutely not my intention. Neither her father nor her are hindu, and she gets her “growths” surgically taken out before they can develop into fully formed limbs. While she does have special abilities, the curse has nothing to do with it and she mostly sees it as a dangerous medical condition. Are there still things I should be mindful about? Or would it be better to change her ethnicity entirely? Thank you for your time. 

A Note on Religious Iconography

Limb generation and multiple arms/ heads are not exclusively a Hindu or Indian trope. Many religions practiced throughout Asia use this feature in their iconography. I think the basic idea is “More hands/ heads = More able to help/ More able to observe”. One variation of a myth about Brahma has him growing an extra head to better view the beauty of his wife from any angle (If memory serves, she didn’t appreciate this and hid herself). Another key thing to remember is that regeneration in myths is not equated to growing a limb for a specific purpose (Ex. The bodhisattva Avalokitesvara growing 1000 arms in Buddhist myths to more easily reach sufferers).

You don’t specify religion for your character here, which would make a big difference. Even a non-religious Indian person is likely to be culturally whatever religion their family is from. You will have readers who will make the kind of associations with Hinduism you are worried about, but that’s on their bias, not yours. Your responsibility is to your world-building, plot and characters so the story can stand on its own. To that end, you’ll need to make sure that you aren’t taking lazy shortcuts with respect to stereotyping and shoddy research. If the prospect of an angry horde of indignant readers scares you, I recommend finding a qualified S. Asian sensitivity reader to help you navigate which faction in S. Asia your story is most likely to piss off.

Medical Logistics?

Now, about her condition: The logistics are not quite clear to me. Is she constantly growing excess organs and limbs? Regrowing damaged ones? At what speed? At what speed do the new growths have to be removed? From what I’ve confirmed with people I know in medicine, I imagine she would be just constantly recovering from various surgeries, and that sounds very miserable.

Perils of Anguish-based Narratives

Forget offensive by Hindu/ Indian standards. I’m just personally bored with stories where the brown person suffers unless you can make it feel less…icky. 

I admit, I’m not enthused by this question because it brings up all sorts of parallels to stories of parasitic twins who are put on display/ worshipped in rural India. The girl referenced by Jaya below had to go into hiding to stay safe from a traveling circus that wanted to put her on display. Having a parasitic twin is very hard on a person’s body. The parasitic limbs and organs consume nutrients the main body needs, so perhaps you’d better research the pathology and consider just how hard you’d like to make your protagonist’s life.

- Marika.

Reminders on S. Asian Incidents Involving Parasitic Twins

I’m going to refer you to my answer about if a character who gives herself four extra limbs should be Indian/ Hindu or not. There are a lot of cultural implications and there have been with four-limbed girls.

My recommendation is no because an Indian person with extra limbs may be worshiped or exploited within a Hindu context. That’s what happened to a real girl named Lakshmi Tatma, who had a parasitic twin.

- Jaya

reine-des-pres

(I thought the comment function would appear on my blog, but I guess not? I haven’t been on Tumblr in months, sorry about that!)

First, thank you for the thorough answer! To clarify, her arc isn’t centered around her curse, it’s just an aspect of her. She’s the protagonist’s 24 year old half-sister, a powerful magic user and a central character to the plot. I didn’t want to bog the ask in detail, as the curse is the only detail I was worried about 😅 

About the medical aspect. My father has been chronically ill since I was very young, and I used to believe he had been “cursed by a witch” when I was small since I didn’t understand what was happening or why. So the symptoms this character has and the way her family treats her mirrors the way my family was growing up, though with a fantasy twist. As in, it’s accepted that she has good and bad days, and her condition is just a normal part of the family life.

The only time this character is in severe pain is when she doesn’t take care of herself and her condition properly. Otherwise, about every month or so, she just needs to take pain medication and visit a friend specializing in healing magic who removes the excess organs/bones before they grow big enough to cause problems. If she’s careful, it’s mostly just an annoyance to her. 

Hopefully this helps to provide some context. But regardless, thank you for the advice, I’ll change her background to avoid bad implications. Would a Sri Lankan and Buddhist family background still be too close for comfort? As in, is the association still going to be uncomfortable no matter what if she is of South Asian descent?

writingwithcolor

First, OP, I empathize. My dad developed non-Hodgkins Lymphoma when I was five and too willfully oblivious to understand what was going on at home. It sucks when you get old enough to understand. Sympathies for your dad as well. Second, why not give the sister leukemia instead of a curse, and have her in remission while the family is potentially facing medical debt? It’s more acceptable because we Indians get cancer too and would avoid any issues with the growing arms implications that we have discussed.

If going this route, however, assuming there are magical treatments equivalent to chemotherapy and surgery, make sure there is no magical cure for cancer. No one likes a cure narrative unless it’s on Fullmetal Alchemist levels with story quality and a price to pay. I can tell that your dad having cancer has weighed on your life and impacted it.

- Jaya

This is clearly a personal issue, but to echo Jaya, I don’t think this curse is an effective chronic illness/ cancer metaphor. I don’t think changing the character’s religion, nationality or ethnicity will improve this curse in the South Asian context. What specifically bothers me is that your portrayal of the sister seems to unrealistically minimize her pain and her family’s awareness of her pain in ways that don’t resonate on a cultural level, particularly with what I know of living with cancer, and my own experiences with chronic pain. My aunt has blood cancer, and while we became acclimated to her condition, we were always aware of what she is going through. You have to understand that in developing countries, health is a major source of concern and tension. Because of the strong stigma against cancer in South Asia, we actively chose to not sensationalize her condition, but even nonverbal support and awareness can effectively highlight the reality of life for a patient with chronic illness.

Your description of your experience with your father conveys heroic efforts to preserve a sense of normalcy. However, I think you must take care to draw the distinction between normalization of pain versus trivializing pain. A person’s suffering can be an unobtrusive fact of life but still have great significance. I bring this up because non-verbal support, active family involvement and compassionate awareness are important behaviors in many Asian cultures, including those in South Asia. If I had a sibling with a painful, chronic illness/ curse, it would be expected that I would accompany them to their treatments unless they specifically objected. You say that your character manages her condition well. However, in a collectivist culture, a person who is ill is very likely to overextend, which is precisely why their family would be on high alert to help them manage their condition. Life would eventually settle into a new normal, but the illness would still play a significant role in the family’s day-to-day life.

- Marika.

south asia south asian character india indian characters surgery tw body horror tw parasitic twins asks lakshmi tatma mod commentary cancer chronic pain chronic illness
writingwithcolor

South Asian Representation We’d Like to See

writingwithcolor

@murdergirlfriend said:

I’d like to ask the south asian/Indian people of WWC what kinds of south asian & Indian characters would you like to see more of?

Marika

As a South Asian:

  • Brahmin characters are overused to depict Hindus, particularly devout Hindus. I’d like to have more well-researched stories about individuals from other castes.
  • In general, Hindus and Indians overall are over-represented in Western fiction. I’d like to hear about people from other religions and countries within the subcontinent.
  • Fleshed out characters with properly researched family backgrounds appropriately placed within the region’s history.
  • South Asian characters involved in narratives that acknowledge oppression, poverty, colonization and ethnic/ religious/ identity politics, but aren’t fixated on these tensions. This might be more of an OwnStories thing simply because I imagine many non-South Asians would find this balance hard to strike.

As a diaspora South Asian:

  • Stories without ABCD angst. We get it. People like to hear about how hard it is to be an immigrant from a weird country with a funny last name, and funny smelling food. I want more stories about desis who get joy and fulfillment from their identity. I want to hear more hopeful, coming of age stories from people empowered through engagement with their heritage.
  • I want more stories about ABCD pan-South Asian solidarity. I was not raised in a Brahmin enclave like many Hindu Brahmins in the US. After 9/11, when being brown was not fun, my Pakistani, Sikh and Sri Lankan friends and I mutually supported each other. We benefited immensely from not fighting our parents’ wars, and to this day, they understand me better than Brahmins back home.

SK

I would like to see characters whose identities as South Asians have more depth. Like Marika, I want to see South Asian characters who don’t view their identity as a burden. I’d also like to see realistic fiction stories of South Asians that don’t revolve around romance and arranged marriage. 

For Sikh characters, I’d like to see Sikhs that aren’t Punjabi. Give me a story about an Afghan Sikh or a Nepali Sikh. I’d also like to see stories that don’t conflate Punjabi culture and Sikhi. I don’t think I’ve ever seen an initiated Sikh in the media. And I want to see women in turbans with swords!

Jaya

I want more fantasy stories where we aren’t there to react to broken systems. Most of the time, South Asians are side characters who exist as a token. Instead, I wish we were more flawed, that we are allowed to grow and change. Connie in Steven Universe felt refreshing because it was a relief to see an Indian kid with pushy parents but could wield a sword and train with holograms.

writingwithcolor

@maximumscherzer

Stories about South Asians from the West Indies would be nice. We exist–even in the US & Canada–in pretty large numbers in places like Florida, Toronto, New York, & New Jersey, but you’d never know from any sort of fiction that includes South Asians. Our experiences are pretty different & aren’t easily swapped out for the experiences of people living in Asia or people whose families emigrated from Asia to western countries without a detour into indenture.

YES! Absolutely! I love this. I have family who emigrated to and from Nigeria and many diaspora acquaintances whose families came from Guyana as well as Trinidad and Tobago. We have an ask where we mention the importance of understanding South Asian diaspora history, and so much of the West is woefully ignorant when it comes to how the practice of indenture was widely used in colonies, particularly by the British. For me personally. so much of how early ethnic enclaves were formed was driven by identity, so knowing this history, is extremely important to my identity as a mixed person in terms of accounting for historically accurate depictions of diversity.

- Marika.

Aside:

@fangirling-account : Idk if I’m allowed to say this, but I think saying “Hindus and Indians overall are over-represented in Western fiction” is a bit of a off? By that I mean, they may be over-represented in regards to other cultures and ethnicities, but they’re still used sparringly. Especially in comparison to white people. Instead of reducing those groups, we reduce the amount of white characters and add other South Asian people that way. My personal take though. Sorry if I overstepped.

I was indeed stating the above in my capacity as a Indian, Hindu South Asian given the specific prompt of the kinds of South Asians we’d like to see more of in fiction. Thank you for the opportunity to clarify my meaning. - Marika.

writingwithcolor

@cuteykitsune

On the part about steven universe. I’m curious about why it is okay to depict overbearing parents. Wouldn’t that be something people don’t want shown in media? Even if they do loosen up. I would just think since there’s so many toxic abusive parents out there it would be bad to depict especially non-white parents this way

Basically, It Depends.

My mom is a doctor like Dr. Maheswaran is and doesn’t understand fantasy, but the difference is that Dr. Maheswaran changed upon learning she didn’t know Connie at all. My mom is still the same. Dad was mellower but had standards to which he held all of us. Seeing Connie in the same situation as someone like me felt like a breath of fresh air.

- Mod Jaya

My parents are also kind of overbearing? However, though overbearing S. Asian parents are a reality, there’s an overabundance of strict S. Asian parents in media and these parents do tend to be strict, so I personally would feel best if this was handled by someone who was a minority themselves and had overbearing parents (Which is not solely a trait tied to Asian POC) because I would feel like they would have the appropriate cultural competence.

I think Steven Universe does Oh Kay at this because they do an all right job at giving Connie’s mom a personality (Especially in the final season, I think her mom was a really cool character), but watching it, I am still tired of seeing the unsupportive, strict, Asian mom stereotype.

- Mod Sophia

As said by Sophia, the problem is that this is often the only common depiction of S. Asian parents.

- SK

Having never watched Steven Universe and having no firm opinion on depictions of strict Asian parents in media, I would like to note that we jumped from “overbearing non-white parents” to “toxic, abusive non-white parents”, which suggests that part of the issue may be in the eyes of the beholder. I think many Asian cultures still allow for a very wide spectrum between the two concepts, and we’ve had enough asks on this subjects that all the Asian mods (!!) are in talks about a writing resource to discuss cultural relativism for parenting within the context of Asian cultures, so look forward to that!

- Marika.

Echoing Marika, from what I’ve seen white parents are more overbearing than the Asian parents I know, and I think much of this is tied to conservative Christianity.

- SK

@kevneils:

I’m indian, enby and bi and really would like to see south asians who are queer and don’t use the byg tropes and show us having happy endings too! props if they don’t speak hindi and/or actually like their culture instead of hating it(which is something I see a lot)

I very much agree! Even homegrown S. Asian media tends to show queer issues with so much tragedy. I think we need both stories that show the real stigma and trauma borne of culture, but also stories that offer hope and the promise of happy endings!

- Marika.

South Asia WWC Representation Plot Ideas India South Asian characters Indian characters mod opinions mod wishlist mod commentary user commentary diaspora histories British imperialism colonialism cultural relativism parenting Steven Universe Connie LGBTQIA+