WritingWithColor (Posts tagged Commentary)

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nuittrouble

Middle Eastern /Arab Muslim mercenaries

writingwithcolor

Anonymous asked:

Hi there. I wanted to write a Middle Eastern action story set in near future Kurdistan. These are 5 of the most important points:

1) It’s about a syndicate called “The Kurdish Order”.

2) My two heroines are a Kurdish woman and her Arab partner.

3) The reason for them living their lives as professional assassins was because their parents were survivors of a civil war in their country.

4) The supporting characters are the Kurdish woman’s parents who contacts her from the headquarters via a radio, and informs her about the targets’ whereabouts.

5) The main villain is an Arab woman whose evil plan is to distribute a lot of firearms to the mercenaries around the world. When the two heroines confronts her and asks, “What did your parents taught you when you were young?”, the villain’s response is; “You’re correct, my nemeses. This is not a ‘My mom and dad hated me for no reason when I was young’ type of excuse. It’s more of a ‘My mom and dad taught me that the world is about the survival of the fittest’ type of motive.”.

The issue here is that I want my story to take place in the Middle East, but I don’t want to perpetuate the “Muslims = Mercenaries” stereotypes. Would my story still work the same if my characters are coded as Christians or Atheists?

I don’t know enough about this topic to speak on it authoritatively but I do want to point out that Kurdistan isn’t currently a country. It isn’t clear from your ask whether you want to set your story in a near-future setting in which Kurds have gained independence and founded their own country, or whether you are referring to the geographic region that spans present-day Turkey, Syria, Iraq and Iran in which Kurdish peoples are mostly concentrated. 

Either way, it’s worth noting that Kurds are currently a marginalized ethnic minority in all of the countries in which they reside. Kurdish nationalism dates back over a thousand years and has a complex history including many instances of violent repression. If you are not Kurdish yourself, I would recommend doing a lot of research into Kurdish history and current political issues before attempting to write this story. 

-Niki

The Middle East is diverse in ethnicities and beliefs. Even though Islam is the religion that many people from the region follow, is not the only one. My suggestion in this case, to avoid the “Muslims = Mercenaries”, is to give your readers a clear image of how much of a mosaic the Middle East is. And this can only happen when the worldbuilding is correctly done and the focus is not only on the Muslims but on the rest of the people as well and their customs. As for the rest of your question, I agree with Niki that before you proceed with this project you must inform yourselves deeply about Kurdish history and especially the current political climate 

-Asmaa

We would like to turn this over to our Kurdish and Arab readers. How do you feel about the asker’s story premise? What advice do you have for them and which stereotypes would you like them to avoid?

nuittrouble

I’m Kurdish, so I’d just like to point out that Kurdish people, especially those living in Turkey, are already suffering from lots of prejudices because of the on-going political issues with the armed guerrilla and political organization PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ Party). It’s important to know that its labelling as a terrorist organization is very controversial and a very touchy subject, but despite that, Kurds are often labelled as terrorists, and it’s one of the many reasons why we’re marginalized. There are many other factors depending on the history of the countries where Kurdish people are mostly concentrated, but I did a brief summary of this specific issue because the whole idea of a Kurdish assassin belonging to a “Kurdish Order” may come off as insensitive to our history if there are no other important Kurdish important characters to balance the general image given of Kurds.

It may be an action story made for fun, but it’s talking about realistic and current issues : a Kurdish organization of assassins, the acknowledgment of Kurdistan as a country… those are very real subjects that cause wars and cost lives still today. If you yourself are Kurdish, I believe you’ll understand what these things truly mean for us. If not, I would advise you to inform yourself deeply about our history and really think about what messages your story will give to the audience, to remain as respectful.

We’re an ethnic minority with a very complex history, so I would actually be more than happy to see Kurdish representation in an action novel, especially if it’s to see a fun story without any political implications, which is something I’ve never come across, since our sole existence and cultural identity seem to be a political issue for people for a reason I don’t even want to understand. But like I explained, the elements in your story do have political implications given our history, so I would advise you to inform yourself to not give off the wrong messages that will further our marginalization.

Kurdish SWANA middle east commentary reblog
writingwithcolor

wanderingwondererer asked:

I am writing a medieval fantasy story, and one of the groups I am writing about have non-binary inhabitants whose social and spiritual role draws inspiration from the Hawaiian Māhū, and the Samoan fa'afafine. I want to pay homage to the beauty of how the fa'afafine and Māhū exist in their respective cultures, but I do not want to disrespect the culture by using the exact name, or any derivatives thereof. Is there a way to honour the culture I have drawn inspiration from without overstepping?

writingwithcolor answered:

Hawaiian and Samoan-inspired Nonbinary Characters

This topic is very nuanced, complex, and intersectional. In all honesty, I ask that you think of whether it’s your place to take inspiration from māhū (as I cannot speak on behalf of Samoan people) after doing more research on these identities from people of Hawaiian and Samoan descent. 

Also, I feel that it is very important that I disclose that in Hawai’i, māhū is sometimes used as a derogatory term toward gay and trans men in modern times and that Hawaiian communities are still in the process of reclaiming the identity after the meaning was twisted this way. 

If you are looking for a good source on Hawaiian māhū, I recommend looking into the film Kumu Hina

Synopsis: 

“KUMU HINA is a powerful film about the struggle to maintain Pacific Islander culture and values within the Westernized society of modern day Hawaiʻi. It is told through the lens of an extraordinary Native Hawaiian who is both a proud and confident māhū, or transgender woman, and an honored and respected kumu, or teacher, cultural practitioner, and community leader.”

Additional Links: 

A short clip from the film defining what māhū means

The Kumu Hina shop page where you can find a link to purchase the Kumu Hina film

  • Ren

Disclaimer before I start: I am what is known as “transmisogyny exempt”, meaning I am not a trans woman or a trans feminine person. I am a TME perisex (not intersex) third gender person, and have education in anthropology, which is why I am responding. Trans women, trans feminine people, and third gender people who are transmisogyny affected are encouraged to respond to this in the comments. 

An interesting little note when it comes to researching Indigenous third genders is: anthropologists (usually cis men) studying them fetishized those who would have been assigned male at birth in Europe/America, and ignored those who would have been assigned female at birth. Both of the genders you named are in this category of “would have been assigned male at birth, so anthropologists studied them”.

As a result, a lot of the true nuance of Indigenous genders have been lost, because once they were done with the fetishizing, they promptly imposed the gender binary and tried to destroy millennia of culture for the sake of colonialism.

I note this fetish because it continues in the modern day. Trans women and trans feminine people—transmisogyny affected people, or TMAs—have hyper-visibility but very little voice share. 

What does this mean? It means that people talk over transmisogyny affected people, and spend very little time listening to them. (most of what I discuss here comes from TMA people and is not something I came up with on my own)

A word of warning, this post is going to be full of microaggressions in quotes that I do not mean in the way the original speakers did, but I am trying to position this through a cis lens (that was initialy used) in order for it to be more broadly understood by those who aren’t very educated on either anthropology or trans issues.

It’s also rather difficult to explain modern bigotry structures as applying to cultures where this historically didn’t exist until colonialism, so just assume everything is written with “as we’d understand” when I use modern terms like TMA, cis, etc. These terms apply in modern day.

European/American anthropologists (who were mostly white, very few not-pale)—who laid an uncomfortable amount of groundwork for modern transmisogyny/ transphobia—did not understand why “a man” (a trans feminine person, a third gender person) would “want” to “give up” their position as “a man” (which Europeans viewed as superior) in order to “become” a woman. 

Trans-centric rewording: anthropologists did not understand cultures where your whole life wasn’t dictated by what other people assumed you were based on genitalia, did not understand self-identification, and did not understand any culture that did not work on a binary system. Because most anthropologists were men, they focused on those who looked like them naked and ignored everyone else.

They also ignored intersex issues, but that’s a whole other rant and this post is long enough.

And thus, gender/sex become colonized and a fetish of trans feminine people—because they were viewed as the most abnormal to the cis white men anthropologists—was ground into the bedrock of white supremacy. 

This is part of why transmisogyny is its own thing, separate from misogyny, because anthropologists were so upset that not everyone they thought should be a man was one. If a trans woman existed, then that meant cis men were not biologically superior to cis women, that gender roles were not biologically mandated, that women’s marginalized roles were artificial, and patriarchy was fake.

Aka, a vested political interest in not validating TMA third gender people, because it would destroy the colonial house of cards.

Also, a lot of this research happened when suffrage was beginning to take root, along with Oscar Wilde’s trial and a general losing control over sex, gender, and relationships. This meant that “women trying to become men” had a vested political interest in not being discussed; same deal with any relationships that Europe would see as same-sex.

This is going to impact your research. All of it, from historical sources to modern revisionism. A lot. Because TERFs and white supremacists and basically everyone racist has a vested interest in continuing to ignore Indigenous practices of sex and gender, and keep trying to make it a Europe-only thing.

One particularly salient quote from my classical anthropology class was an anthropologist not even understanding why (what we’d understand as) a TMA third gender person was married to a cis man, because the third gender person could do both men’s and women’s roles, which made the cis man “useless” in the relationship.

All of this is a very long-winded way of asking: why are you so inspired by third genders that are commonly associated with trans feminine people, why do you find them so magical, and have you examined your sources for a fetishizing bias?

Third gender people are not your magical pure perfect spiritual beings to deify. As I detailed above, the research has been flawed from the start. 

I also notice that you don’t have any mention of the cultures that made the Māhū and fa'afafine, just their gender roles. This isn’t respectful, and is instead a micro-issue of what I describe in this guide: Crafting a Fantasy Culture or the fallacy of culture in the singular

Gender and gender expression is cultural. It’s a huge problem when people look across cultures or even subcultures and assume a man must be GNC or not cis because he’s dressed in a way that is atypical of white, Christian, Western masculinity. Pink and pastels are not universally feminine, bright colours are not always a sign a man loves other men. The same is said for women— you cannot identify a woman’s level of gender conformity to her culture by using the standards of white, Western culture.

So unless you take more markers of Hawaiian and Samoan culture, especially their other genders (including men and women), you’re going to end up with a thing that falls flat.

Just a note that a quick google search showed me Samoans also have fa’afatma, who would be more understood as trans masculine people. The fact you only mention fa’afafine is part of fixating on trans feminine people, which is a form of fetishization and bias. Samoans have four genders, not three.

Third gender people were often associated with religious practices, yes. It’s wonderful that so many Indigenous cultures around the globe have more than two genders, and it’s even more wonderful that these genders have had some of their traditions preserved despite very aggressive colonialism trying to destroy them.

But unless you have ties to these communities, is it really your place to talk about them in detail?

The need to show non binary people in fantasy is strong. The desire to have it be grounded in something that existed in a certain period of time is also strong. But the way to go about doing this isn’t to grab an Indigenous culture’s practices in a cherry picking way.

The way to do it is to look at the society you have set up—yes, the very European society you have probably set up—and to ask how this society would have imagined the concept of someone third gender.

Cause here’s a secret: that historical revisionism I mentioned for Indigenous societies happened in Europe, too.

Non binary people have existed in Europe for forever. Some of them came from being intersex before hormonal and surgical treatments were a thing; others came from the same source as perisex (non-intersex) non binary people come from today, that you’re just not a man or a woman. 

And you’ll come up with something much more real, much more authentic, if you just take the time to sit down and ask how your fantasy society handles those outside the binary.

Sure, take inspiration from various third genders and use that to boost up your imagination. But unless you are taking solidly coded Hawaiian and Samoan cultures, or at least solidly Polynesian coded cultures, with the amount of research necessary to avoid fetishization, it’s… not going to be the respectful vision you want.

And remember the voice share thing I mentioned? Yeah. Is it really your story to grab inspiration from a wildly marginalized, fetishized, and otherwise oppressed group in modern day? When actual Māhū and fa'afafine have a hard time getting their own stories out there?

So by all means, research them! Elevate their stories! But maybe, for a medieval fantasy world that I’m assuming is set in Fantasy World 24 (aka vaguely Europe), make up your own thing that’s rooted in a more Western experience and honour third gender people around the world by making a European society have them.

Cause trust me. Europe was not the pinnacle of gender binary life its whole existence. There’s plenty of room to make up whatever, and simply acknowledge third gender people exist. That’s plenty respectful, that’s within your lane, and that’s really solidly honouring the history of third gender people without appropriating anything.

Just be cautious of using “oh they’re so beautiful I want to honour them” as your logic. It’s a very pure motive, yes, but it’s one that leads you to overstepping boundaries very often. Especially if you’ve only done a surface-level skim of random sources and thought they were wonderful. Do the research, first, and then consider it.

~Mod Lesya

writingwithcolor

@erenaeoth​ has very graciously offered a starting place for researching gender in early Christian Europe for all of your worldbuilding inspiration needs, with buckets of academic sources:

Non-Binary and Trans Identity in Late Antique and Medieval Europe and the Eastern Roman Empire

Please go read this to see just how differently gender was viewed in historical time periods, and what sort of framework you can use to turn Fantasy World 29 into something that has properly contextualized non binary representation for European societies

~ Lesya

reblog gender transgender worldbuilding Europe history medieval commentary non binary rome
cuban-feminist-that-gives-a-hoot

carenrose asked:

I have a surgeon character in a 25th century sci-fi setting (Star Trek), working on a spaceship, who is Cuban. She was born in Cuba and lived there until she was 7, then moved to California, and may or may not have moved back to Cuba before she became an adult.

Right now, she could be ""any other"" ethnicity/nationality, but she's supposed to be Cuban.

There's 400 years of fictional history (now - 2400s) that no one has come up with, and since history to some extent impacts culture, I feel like I'm at a loss. I found a specific city that has a yearly parade that's a big thing, but beyond that I don't have much.

She's also autistic, and most autistic characters are kids, white men, and sometimes white women. She doesn't fit the typical Hispanic/Latino stereotypes, but that "defaults" her to white in the common perception.

I hope this ask makes sense, thanks!

writingwithcolor answered:

Original Cuban character in Star Trek fanfiction, Futurist Country

We don’t have active Cuban mods right now, so we are going to pass this along to Cuban and Cuban-diaspora followers, especially Cuban-American. Please respond in the notes.

How to write a country in the future

The good news is that you are writing science fiction, which is inherently speculative fiction – so you get to speculate! Read some history and get some ideas. 

Cuban/Cuban diaspora followers –

  • What are some things that would both make you happy or annoy you if a sci-fi writer had it happen in Cuban history over the next 400 years? 
  • If someone didn’t really make up any future history and just had a character in space who grew up in Cuba without going into detail about what it was like, would that be all right with you or bug you?

(OP, hopefully you’ll get a multiplicity of answers because no group is a monolith.) History does impact culture – for example, back in the early 2000’s my college roommate has suggested that Jean-Luc Picard (who is French) speaks with a British accent because England colonized France in the future – but if the focus of your fanfiction is something else especially if it’s in space, personally I don’t think you have to make up an entire future history just to make her Cuban. Disclaimer that I am just one opinion and naturally I defer to Cuban/Cuban diaspora followers here.

Choice of backstory

Some information that you might find useful – according to the 2010 census, around 1.26 million Cuban Americans live in Florida compared with 98,000 in California. That’s almost thirteen times as many. However, you can still write what you described, because 1. Those 98 thousand people exist and matter too and 2. Even if they didn’t, I understand that Starfleet Academy and other important Star Trek things are in California, so there’s always a way to write things that aren’t the most common combination in real life. (Anyone from anywhere has to go where Starfleet is; I understand that.) The lived experiences might be different for Cubans in California vs Florida because of the size of the community, so make sure you’re specifically researching what it’s like to be part of the Cuban disapora in California.

In other words: why California? Is it because of Starfleet? That’s fine. Is it because Cuban is a form of Latin and California has a large Latin population? That’s still okay, just be aware that the Cuban diaspora population isn’t what it is in Florida.

Defaulting to white because of not fitting stereotype

“She doesn’t fit the typical Hispanic/Latino stereotypes, but that “defaults” her to white in the common perception.“

I am uncomfortable with this line. So you’re saying other characters perceive her as white because she doesn’t fit present-day, 21st century stereotypes of what it means to be a Latina? I’d change this detail if this were my story. Also this is Star Trek; far away in space they don’t seem to treat individual human ethnicities as crucial as the fact that we’re from Earth anyway. Why would they just not take her at face value as an Earth person who says she’s Latina?

If you are using Trek fanfic as a way to write out your own experiences of being hurtfully defaulted to white by others, by the way, that is obviously fine.

–Shira

cuban-feminist-that-gives-a-hoot

My time to *shine* on answering these questions:

1. A truly free Cuba would make me immensely happy in future Cuba's history. Now, what I mean by a free Cuba is this: that Cuba becomes a democracy without being America's bitch. I've seen a couple of folks with their manifest goggles on too tightly wanting Cuba to become part of the US, which... Fuck no. I've seen how the U.S. treats Puerto Rico and I don't want that for Cuba.

(A major aside as I saw the default to white thing and wanted to touch upon this: I'm a relatively white-looking Cuban-American (relative in that I'm pale as fuck, but got the dark hair and hazel eyes) and the jokes my ex made about me being the whitest Latino he's ever met was... Not appreciated, to put it lightly. Not to mention that me not speaking Spanish and living in pretty white parts of the states, both in the past and currently has people assuming I'm white. I'm pretty quick to correct that assumption if people bring it up, but unless folks are just that curious, folks aren't going to ask, so it is OK for the MC to like stereotypically white people things, but balance it out in other ways, like in their choice in food or how they speak of their family history.)


2. If you're not certain of what you want in the history, I don't have a problem with vagueness in the story itself, but it helps to at least have an idea of it written down, just in case, for your notes. Although even though there is a Cuban population in California and Starfleet is based there, I'd still be asking what compelled the family (if not current gen, then past generations) to choose California over South Florida as their place to settle once leaving Cuba.

wwc commentary Cuba Cuban
writingwithcolor

“Writing all Races Equally”, Problems Inherent In That Attitude

writingwithcolor

@missdrarrydawn​ asked:

Hi! I recently joined a very diverse writing group in order to learn more about other races and ethnicities from people living those experiences so that I can include diversity in my own writing in a healthy, balanced way, and it has been a lot of fun, but then yesterday there was a conflict which resulted in me getting removed from the group. Most of the POC in the group are from the USA, but I’ve grown up in, and still live in, a small European country, so A LOT of the negative tropes and stereotypes about POC that are deeply rooted in the USA are things that are basically non-existent where I live (mostly because there’s not really any people of color living here). I had always been under the assumptions that POC characters are best written just as regular people with emotions and struggles and relationships etc., not reduced to just their race and treated more special/more negative for the color of their skin. They’re just normal people after all. 

My idea had been to write POC characters the same way I would write my white characters, with the same respect and depth and not treat their skin color as something special or exotic or anything like that. However, when I expressed that to the writing group, a lot of the people there got very upset with me, telling me that the way I viewed writing POC was disrespectful and that I couldn’t write any POC characters or POC coded characters the same way as white people because they are inherently different and therefore must be written in different ways. I could see I’d hurt a lot of the other writers from the group, and I tried to apologize but the damage had been done. Now obviously I’m not going to sit here and say they are all wrong and I am right, but I do wonder if this is a widely held opinion, because in my head, all races are equal and I wouldn’t have ever given writing one race more thought or care over another until this experience made me question that.

 Is the idea that POC characters have to be written with more care than a white character and treated better or with more respect or thought because of all the racism in real life a stance held by the majority or could this be a product of centuries of racism and oppression that caused a lot of POC people to request that they be written with so much more compassion than anyone else because of frustrations of never receiving equal treatment and finally being sick of it? I do want to clarify though that this wouldn’t apply to writing about a culture or religion, because those are very special and sacred things that I will always do a lot of research on before attempting to write about, here I’m just talking about writing POC characters on their own, not related to a culture or a religion, although I realize as I write this that that might be an issue all of its own, but that’s something for me to reflect on and ask about another day because this is getting really long and I don’t want it to get any longer. I know this isn’t a directlywriting related question and I apologize, but you have an amazing writing blog with a lot of perspective and thought put into it so asking you guys was my first thought after I’d gotten kicked out. Thank you for your time :)))

WWC Note: this ask has been edited down to just the points we’re replying to:

Colourblindness

The attitude you hold is called “colorblindness” and it’s a problem for multiple reasons, the primary one being:

White is not the default emotional experience of the world, and assuming we’re all the same is the biggest way ignorance-based racism persists. 

When you begin to assume that everyone has a generally similar life path that’s only faintly informed by race, you ignore everything that shapes a person. You currently view your own white experience as the default that anyone has the potential to live if they have the same class, gender, sexual orientation, religion (including cultural religion), and education as you.

But this is a fallacy, and a person’s race will modify everything they have experienced even if they are identical to you in every other way.

The thing about marginalized groups is, we have assimilation pressures. Native people have been forced to live like white people for centuries, and it’s resulted in a lot of bloodshed. A lot of critique of the adoption system is about how white saviour-y it is, and how much trans-racial adoptees (aka, adoptees that are different races and cultures from their adopted parents) suffer either because their white parents refuse to participate in their culture, or assume that because the child of colour is from a white family in a white-majority area, they won’t experience racism because, somehow by the virtue of having white parents, they’ll magically get access to white privilege. 

Aka, it’s traumatizing. Very traumatizing. Even if you weren’t directly being assimilated, the trauma just… lingers. It’s generational. Your body remembers, your bloodline remembers.

And the impact of writing colourblind is: a lot of PoC will feel assimilated into white society, when society already tells you that you should assimilate, and it hurts. One of my biggest points in writing diverse characters is: you have to be careful you’re not re-skinning your own values onto a different skin tone. Remember how I said culture and race are often interlinked, even in a diverse area? This is part of it.

Equity vs Equality

There’s a concept in social justice: equality vs equity. Equality forces everyone to be the same, while equity accounts for their differences. This comic illustrates: Equity vs equality vs justice.

For example, equality is having everyone wear the same sized hat. But if you have thicker, fluffier hair (either curly or coiled) then your hair won’t fit in the hat. As a result, many PoC (especially Black) are forced to wear their hair much shorter, because their hair won’t fit in the required hat. This is assimilation

Equity would acknowledge that people have a right to wear their hair however they want, and has multiple sized hats available for people of all different hair textures to wear. They might all be in the same colours or style, so you can tell they’re all from the same place, but they are varied and allow people the freedom of self expression. This is equity that results in actual equality, because it allows everyone the same level of freedom of self expression with their hair.

Intersectionality

Writing from a colorblind perspective is the fastest way to hamstring any research efforts for where to put equity, because you are assuming sameness and therefore not researching. Your assumption when writing any sort of character of colour should be assuming difference, because everyone—white people included—have a racialized experience.

This is the principle of intersectionality: that the mixing of any race with anything else will produce a unique experience. A Black Muslim will experience the world differently than an Arab Muslim, and both will experience the world differently from a white Muslim. A Native woman will experience the world differently than a Persian woman. A white trans man will have a wildly different experience than a Chinese diaspora trans man.

They will share similarities, yes, because people are people and anything shared will produce some sameness between experiences. But if you assume that the white experience is the default, you’ll miss all of those intersections and write something inauthentic. The amount of sameness is probably a lot less than you think of on first pass. And then on pass twenty, you’ll realize a bunch of similarities you probably never considered.

It is not reducing people to their race when you acknowledge that race influences every part of your life. It is respecting their unique experience as a person of colour.

Racial Influence

So yes, it is a commonly held view that you should write characters of colour as being deeply influenced by their race, because their race influences everything about them. This isn’t even getting into how a lot of things white people assume are constants aren’t; emotions, gender, sexual orientation, mental illness* and emotional expressions are all culturally influenced.

Racism has existed for five hundred odd years (since the concept of race was invented for European colonialist ends), but xenophobia has existed ever since people have existed. As soon as you are Other, you have a different experience than the dominant culture. You’ll probably make a new culture, or will have already had a new culture that made you the Other.

Assuming we’re all the same, while it looks kind-hearted, is actually the fastest way to invalidate everyone around you. It closes your ears to hearing about difference. Yes, we are all people, yes we all have feelings and likes and dislikes and interests and we can share many, many, many things. But our relationship to those things will still be influenced by where we came from. 

A person who listened to a certain band to survive a terrible time in their life will have a much different relationship to that band than someone whose parents were fans of them so they associate it with happy times. If you can understand the difference between those two people, and realize you should write their internal lives while listening to the same song differently because of that different experience, you can understand the difference that race and culture will produce in response to the same stimulus. 

~ Mod Lesya

* a cross-cultural study of schizophrenia showed that in two non-Western cultures (Accra, Ghana; and Chennai, India) auditory hallucinations aren’t seen as scary, and are instead seen as ancestors helping guide. This positive-to-neutral view of voices was not found in the American population of schizophrenics, who universally found the voices bad and destructive, indicating there is a strong cultural component to views of your mental illness even if you experience the same symptoms.

Placing Care

As to why you need to put more care into writing characters of color than you would white characters: it’s not because people of color want to be treated better in fiction out of some sort of affirmative action to make up for the racism we experience in real life. It’s because it’s always more difficult, on a writing skill level, to write about things that you aren’t familiar with, than about things you know well.

This principle applies to a lot of things. If you’re writing a story set in a location you’ve never been to before, it will require you to put in a lot more work to write it accurately than if it was set in your hometown. Same for a story set in a time period you don’t know well, versus a contemporary story. Or for a story about a character who has a highly specialized job you know nothing about.

Skill and Difficulty Levels

Think of it as a difficulty setting in a video game. The more you add variables that you are unfamiliar with, the more you’re raising the difficulty level. Writing a story set in your home town in the present day with characters who share your background and life experiences is playing on easy mode. (There’s nothing wrong with playing on easy mode. In fact, until your skill level increases, I recommend it.) Writing a story set in the 12th century on a different continent with characters who are nothing like you? That’s a lot harder. And will require a lot more effort, and care, and research. If you go about it carelessly, you’re bound to get things wrong, and the story won’t be very good.

This also applies to writing characters of color as a white person. Especially as a white person who has little to no interactions with people of color in your daily life.

You wouldn’t assume “well, 12th century South Africa is basically the same as present-day Europe,” right? Even if you don’t know how exactly it’s different, you assume the differences exist, and you put in the care and effort and research necessary to learn about them before writing. Similarly, don’t assume writing characters of color is basically the same as writing white characters. You might not understand what the differences are, but that doesn’t mean they don’t exist. It just means you can’t see them, and need to put in the work to learn about them.This is why you need to write your characters of color with more care than your white characters. It’s because there’s more that you don’t know, and it will be more difficult to get it right.

Authors of color aren’t exempt from this, by the way. Whenever we write characters whose background we don’t share and aren’t intimately familiar with, we need to put in more care than we would writing about characters who are just like us. It’s a question of competency. You have to be aware of what you don’t know, and be willing to put in the work to learn, in order to do right by your characters.

People and Culture

Lastly, I want to draw your attention to this sentence in your ask: “I’m just talking about writing POC characters on their own, not related to a culture or a religion.” You said yourself that you realized as you were writing it there might be something wrong with this way of thinking, and you were right. Nobody exists outside of culture. Unless you’re writing characters who got their memories wiped before getting dropped on an isolated, uninhabited planet, they have a culture. They have been immersed in culture since the day they were born, and that has shaped who they are. You have a culture that has shaped you, and if you don’t think about it as culture, it’s because you’re so immersed in it that it’s invisible to you. And so you assume your cultural background is just what “normal” is, and you expect everyone to share it by default. Anything that deviates from it sticks out to you as “culture”, while everything that aligns itself with it is just the way things are. This is flawed thinking, and you only start realizing it when you become exposed to other people’s “normal” and notice how those are different from yours.

- Mod Niki

Historical Context for Colorblindness

A little background on colorblindness: It’s a deeply ingrained philosophy in Western spheres that emerged over the latter half of the 20th Century, with the Civil Rights Movement in the US and other activist movements providing a push to view people equally. The Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King’s quote from his I Have A Dream speech, “I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character,” is a major backbone of the approach. Most of the people that preach this philosophy tend to have grown up in white-majority suburban areas, which shapes the culture surrounding race very differently from non-white majority areas.

From a racial-ethnic socialization (R-ES) standpoint, it typically emerges in children aged 2-5, as this is when they first start encountering children who look different from them–their parents tell them to treat everyone nicely and that it doesn’t matter what they look like. Psychologically, it changes attitudes towards race and reduces general capability of understanding the differences in experience based on race, like Lesya said before. Many adolescents discovering their own opinions on race can run into this barrier when confronting their biases and struggle with their conception of race in the absence of encouraged discussion of race and its related issues.

Internal Bias Because of Colorblindness

Racial Colorblindness can limit understanding of intersectional issues such as wealth inequality, sexism, queerphobia, etc., as race affects every part of a person’s life. One’s ability to empathize on common issues can also be affected. This approach to socialization affects perception of facets of identity in most respects. Many believe that they judge entirely based on merit or behavior, even when their unconscious bias proves otherwise.

Even though it’s really only been super widespread since the 60s/70s-ish, it’s everywhere in Western media. After the popularization of the approach, the representation of various groups and the messaging spread about race began to reflect it. This continued to the point where it’s being socialized into people of all races beyond the normal parental racial-ethnic socialization. It can affect how children of color approach racism and discrimination before learning coping skills. It can lead to isolation from their culture of origin because they struggle to reconcile the very real issues they see in their communities with their upbringing. In recent years the approach has started to fade, but its legacy remains, and the ill effects can be combated through education and extended R-ES. 

Writing characters with a colorblind eye means that character is probably not going to reflect actual experiences, and if the goal is representation, that isn’t going to cut it. 

 ~ Mod Abhaya

Published Nov 2021

writingwithcolor

Hi all! Marika here with the official WWC response as we note the traffic on this post.

We invite people to read the post carefully in recognition that this is a recommendation written by multiple non-white moderators for a blog that specializes on writing with issues of race, ethnicity and relevant cultural and identity dimensions thereof. As it stands, many moderators come from backgrounds related to the social sciences and psychology or are actively working in fields that put them in close proximity to many PoC and issues of inequality and identity, including race, ethnicity, culture and religion. Bluntly, to assess our content as theoretical and strictly opinion-based contradicts fact.

Therefore, readers are invited to consider that our answers cover a wide range of experiences, particularly experiences that are underrepresented, as opposed to those that may resonate the most with a single, individual perspective.

In our experience, there are certainly PoC who do not experience race as a central part of their identity, but experiences with race and identity run a wide spectrum. For instance:

  1. Rune, our Korean moderator lives in Korea as a mono-racial ethnic Korean.
  2. Jess is a Taiwanese American and experiences race as a mono-racial Asian individual living in the United States  
  3. I (Marika) am a half-Japanese, half-desi person who has lived on multiple continents and whose racial identity depends purely on who I’m talking to, and their personal biases with respect to race.

The social construct of race and how people utilize it in different places affects all of us differently, shaping us into different people, Is it racial essentialism to point out the above? Is it racial essentialism to acknowledge that the spectrum of human racial experience is broad? Is anything lost by observing that experiences contradicting colorblind narratives were until recently often seen as reactionary or divisive, and thus dismissed?

My view is that none of these experiences invalidate each other because they are all true, and any author who seeks to depict their characters in a compelling way would be wise to consider the diversity of human experience if their goal is to create stories that resonate with many people, as opposed to a mere few, particularly when those few have been overrepresented thus far by simple virtue of global structures of power and inequality.

If this is not a pursuit that appeals to a reader of our blog, then perhaps our content is not what the reader is really seeking. Similarly, I think individuals who find our content to be suspect or who think our content does not reflect their perspective should consider if their primary reaction is to tell us why we are mistaken, or whether they are keen to engage in dialogue so we can all learn more from each other.

In my personal experience, there is a difference between pushing personal ideology versus making an effort to better objectively understand others. I’m curious how many of our naysayers are interested in understanding how the moderator team forms its response in the same way we are curious about the basis for their own assertions.  All the moderators, despite differences in both life experiences and opinion, spend much of our time in collaboration and discussion.  Are they keen to join us in understanding how we each arrived at our respective positions? Or are they only concerned with telling others what to think?

  • Marika.
reblog commentary Writing with Color Blog Things race racism colorblind racism colorblindness colorblind
cowboycelestials

h0norary-nasty asked:

So I’m writing a black female character with a deceased mother and a father who loves and dotes on her, but can’t be around very often because he’s a high ranking military official. I know absentee parents is a trope for black characters and I was wondering if my depiction fell into this trope? And if it does, how can I change it to be more respectful?

writingwithcolor answered:

Absent, but loving, Black military father

The deceased mother

Well, it would be more innovative for the mom to just not be dead. I just love it when Black women are alive in stories and remain so! ;) I laugh…but I’m serious! Dead parents is a trope in itself, obviously not “off-limits”, but these days I find it more unique and welcoming when both parents are alive. 

The “absent” Black father 

A busy father is also not necessarily a neglectful one, especially if he’s trying and you show that in your narrative. Whether that’s through communicating as often as possible (letters, video chats, email, phone calls…) and /or ensuring she’s taken care of with a relative or friend that looks after or checks in on her (and depending on her age, lives with her).

It’s a point of conflict but doesn’t read as neglect on the surface. He’s a high ranking official, though, so might he have more access to get in touch with his daughter back home than most? This is me asking with no military experience and without knowing what country your character is from. 

If others with military connections can chime on parenting, especially single parenting, communication while in the military, or Black military families, that would be great.

~Mod Colette

cowboycelestials

Can only answer for U.S. military, but it depends on their job as far as how available they are, as well as what is meant by "high-ranking official"; is this a high-ranking officer or a high-ranking enlisted? There's quite a difference between, say, a general vs. a master sergeant. The father could have a desk job or have a hard labor job maintenancing military vehicles. There's also a big difference is salary.

Generally, a parent who is not neglectful and is loving of their children will try to compensate as much as they can for their absence. There's a deep-seated worry that they aren't enough or doing enough for their children. Maybe he sends a lot of gifts that remind him of his daughter; maybe she likes to play video games and he buys her the newest console or gaming PC he finds at the PX/Exchange. Maybe when he travels outside the base, he finds something nice at civilian stores that she may like. Maybe he calls home or texts whenever he has free time. Maybe she gets an allowance. Maybe he pays for haircare/getting her hair done professionally. Maybe he's set aside a college fund for her, so if she decides to go to college, she can afford to go. Maybe he'll cover the price of her car. Maybe he'll pay for her phone and the phone bill. Maybe he can afford to pay for her travel, and she can come visit him or explore the country he's stationed in.

Keep reading

writingwithcolor

More excellent commentary!

@rantasmal-and-phesplendent​ said:

I can only answer for the US military but definitely the higher ranking you are the more access to communication you have at the sacrifice of free time, depending on his job he may be always “on call” so to speak

@omg-whydidimakethisaccount​ said:

Black Military family members here: Depending where they are stationed at determines how much contact they are able to make. Unless the character is in a war or in a very restricted space, he should be able to contact his daughter on a regular. Maybe not through video calls, but at least text messages her every morning and night. Make time to have video chats. And like this post says, a military parent who doesn’t neglect their children will leave them with the best care

commentary Black military military Black families military family
writingwithcolor

Greek myths with diversity. Indian, East Asian, Polynesian/Tahitian Black characters

writingwithcolor

@paulinainbookland​ said:

Hi!My question is pertaining to my upcoming YA contemporary fantasy series that’s gonna be modern retellings of certain greek myths. The series takes place in a fictional fantasy country called Olympius. I want my series to be diverse, especially with the characters. For example, even though race doesn’t technically exist, Hera is portrayed as an Indian woman, Hecate as an east asian woman, Amphitrite as a polynesian/tahitian woman while Persephone, Psyxhe, Demeter, and Aphrodite are all black as examples. I also want to integrate Greek culture into the stories. My question is, can this be done even with racially diverse characters??

I think a better way to think about this question is to ask yourself “Who were the Ancient Greeks?” Research the histories and economies of those city-states and empires, as well as the other civilizations they would have interacted with in the Mediterranean, Central Asia and South Asia. I notice that you are mixing racial coding with nationality and ethnicity, which I advise against.

  • There was no “India” 2500 years ago.
  • Tahiti similarly wasn’t inhabited until the 11th century

Ask yourself what kind of people you are picturing when you use these descriptors and why? Thus, your problem is twofold:

  1. Shedding notions conflating race with ethnicity and nationality
  2. Doing actual research to better understand what level of diversity in physical appearance one could reasonably expect for a setting where the Olympus of Ancient Greece is transposed onto a modern setting.

- Marika.

writingwithcolor

@isaakandreyevs and @libelluslucis both added their perspectives as Greek people, which included a point that was missed in the initial ask: that Greek mythology and culture was appropriated by white supremacists, colonizers, and “intellectuals” of Western Europe, which makes the concept of Greek mythology without any Greek people in it very hurtful.

We very much appreciate the addition, and would like to emphasize: mythologies without their peoples in it are usually (99% of the time) hurtful, and you really need to ground your work in the people you’re taking from, even if you think it’s fine.

Initial appropriation can last centuries, perpetuated ad infinitum because nobody thinks to break the cycle, and this is a very good example of it.

Greek commentators are encouraged to add more perspectives!

~ Mod Lesya

Greek Mythology reblog commentary Greek greece
lastrose-ofsummer

Fantasy Brazil with Lots of Mixes: What Does “Diversity” Look Like?

writingwithcolor

@allmycolorsforyou​ submitted:

Hello! Thank you so much for your work here! So, I’ve read the posts in the fantasy tag, but I’d like to tell you about my plot just to make sure there isn’t anything wrong I’m not seeing. The fantasy setting of my books is totally inspired by Brazil’s culture, vegetation, mixed races, etc. My main characters are 3 girls and a boy and they’re on a journey together. They’re the same species (fae) but represent different types of people (brazilian japanese, brazilian polish, afro brazilian and a mixed race like European + Afro + Natives). The setting is a whole new world (a throne of glass diverse and gay, if you will) and nothing in particular about their origin culture will take place in the story bc the land is an extremely diverse place like Brazil so their culture is the result of many mixed ones. I’m not giving them Asian or Afro ou Native names bc there’s no Japan ou Africa ou Brazil. The enemy are humans who come in all shapes and races and an evil monster whose personification is… not figured out yet but for sure it’s not human. It may or may not possess humans along the way but I guess I just have to make sure he takes people from different races?

Overarching Notes on the Premise: 

This is a piece of information for you to look at further, and the first thing that I pinged about this ask: you’ve picked inspiration from a pro-colonial, pro-assimilation work, from an author who has some deeply misogynistic themes in her other books. Throne of Glass (and subsequent books) contains lines about how it’s fine that a single person rules the world with near-absolute power so long as they’re nice about it, and has pro-assimilation undertones the minute a brown person steps on the page ¼ into book one. It’s subtle, but by having a brown person want to learn the ways of her colonizer to maybe overthrow him, all the while being shocked the MC knows her language and treating the MC as special for it, was enough that it pinged a red flag for me; I was proven right in later books. Meanwhile, the Court series has all sorts of abusive men acting out of “love”, and sacrifices character development for the sake of m/f romantic pairings.

This isn’t to say a work inspired by such a setting can’t be good, but to illustrate some problems you might’ve missed when taking inspiration from it. The issues run way deeper than “it’s mostly white straight people.”

On “Diversity”

Diversity is much, much more than having characters of colour described in ways that shows they have not-white features and not-European customs. Similarly, crafting a diverse fantasy country/culture is much, much more work than simply copy/pasting modern cultural dynamics into a fantasy setting and handwaving the history to say “and stuff happened to create this.”

Modern (and historical) diversity came as a result of trade, cultural diffusion among neighbouring but different groups, migration, immigration, war, and colonialism.

You can’t approach fantasy diversity without at least some of those factors. It will ring so unrealistic it will pull the vast majority of your readers out of the story (especially your marginalized ones).

Culture (and things like skin tone) are determined by the natural world, history, and outside cultures rubbing (or smashing) against each other. No single culture exists in a vacuum, which means fantasy cultures cannot exist in a vacuum.

People had wars. People traded. People married. People decided to move across a continent and settle there because they liked the weather better. Countries took over other territories, stole stuff, traded stuff, had wars, had peace treaties, looked over the fence and went “and we’re gonna change it just enough so it’s firmly ours but anyone who looks at the two side by side can see they’re influenced by the other.” Nobility would marry from a trade ally and then those two cultures would intermingle.

This is just people being people. You can get some fantastic cultures out of these scenarios, but they come with the ever-present reminder that no one place creates a single culture.

Ergo, your basic assumption that a single landmass without external cultures can create Brazil—diverse, multicultural Brazil—is false. You need external cultures to engage with your primarily shown culture, because Brazil did not create itself; it is the product of its history, and that history includes the rest of the world.

Brazil’s History

Brazil in its modern form was created via colonialism. Sad, but true.

“Basic” Brazilian culture is going to be influenced by slavery, Indigenous peoples, Portugal, and the fact most of these peoples settled in a continental rainforest when they’re (usually) not from one. It has deep roots in the African diaspora, was shaped from the top by the biggest slave trading nation in the period looking to maximize profit (look up how many crops got introduced to the region for trading ends), and by all of these people either killing off, enslaving, or working with the Indigenous peoples of the rainforest to either make space, or survive.

And even just among the Indigenous peoples, there were probably over two thousand of them, Pre-Columbus. Brazil is now down to a couple hundred, but there could be more because of how many uncontacted people there are in the Amazon.

Once you get beyond the colonialism, then you get into immigration. Japanese-Brazillian people are primarily from Okinawa, and are the result of Okinawan customs getting modified for the non-island setting, plus bumping into general Brazilian culture. Polish people will have a similar sort of tug of war: their customs probably got modified to account for living in a totally different environment with wildly different resources available.

This, as you can see, did not happen by accident. This was a set of very deliberate choices by outsiders, those choices eventually creating the Brazil we know today. 

You don’t have to go recreating the exact climate of colonialism to get to something that looks like modern Brazil (and, please don’t, your Afro-Brazilian and Indigenous readers will thank you for it), but you do need outsiders. 

I’m going to nitpick on the names here: it really doesn’t feel good to read that you want to recreate known cultural diversity, but don’t want to give people culturally-accurate names. Names are not only a good way to code characters as being from a certain culture, but names are often what diaspora populations cling to as reminders of where they came from. 

By flattening everything into a general concept of “everyone is Brazilian and comes from here because I say so”, what you end up doing is picking up the pro-assimilationist stitch I mentioned is present in Throne of Glass. 

Part of respecting diversity is acknowledging people might not’ve always lived here, but they’ve now made this place home and are making the best of it. This is especially true for those who were on the disenfranchised side of the colonialism power dynamic. (With colonizers, part of respecting diversity is having them stop being in power and give power back to those who they disenfranchised). 

So look at what made all these populations end up in Brazil, and see how you’re going to modify that (or copy it) to get all of these diverse people in the same place. Brazil has a great potential for internal diversity, yes, it had two thousand unique Indigenous nations, but it won’t create customs that had been codified on an island nation, like Okinawa, because it isn’t an island. It won’t create a people who had spent centuries living in primarily savannah and modified customs from there to a rainforest, like West African peoples.

And even the concept Brazil would only create people who lived in a rainforest, uninfluenced by the mountains or the coast or deserts, is ahistorical, because peoples would share borders, and trade, and talk, and marry, and spread ideas around. Rainforest peoples were influenced by mountain and desert people, because ideas spread from the mountains and the desert. And those peoples were influenced by Polynesians, sailing across the pacific. 

If you want advice on how to properly code people as being from different fantasy countries, check out my guide: Representing PoC in Fantasy When Their Country Doesn’t Exist

The Villain

Trying to diversify your villains is a hard thing to juggle, because most villains are already pretty diverse. That’s what was said to make them villains: the fact they weren’t white, straight, cis, and/or abled.

It’s why villains have darker skin and clothing. It’s why they’re usually theatrical and flamboyant and gender non conforming. It’s why they often have canes. These deviations away from “white upper class sound-minded physically fit people performing expected gender roles” were the subconscious clues to the audience we shouldn’t like them. 

Even if you only take villains that match the same race as your protagonists, you can still end up with problems like colourism (the system of oppression that makes paler skin within PoC groups more desirable), or a sort of bias that makes you describe the villains as just that little bit more not-white than the protagonists. 

Without skin tone as a factor, most villainous shorthands are still some sort of marginalized group: smaller eyes are stereotyped as an East Asian trait, large noses can be Jewish or Arab, dark curly hair can be Jewish or African, the list goes on. Anything that isn’t pale skin, average-sized eyes, a European nose, rosey cheeks, and blond or medium brown hair has probably been used as a villain shorthand to invoke some sort of marginalized group.

There is also the tricky topic of mixed race or mixed culture vs mono-culture/ race people. You haven’t specified any of your villains’ ethnicities and it doesn’t look like you’ve even picked them, but let me give a warning: mixed people are fetishized, and are often put on a pedestal above mono-racial people; alternatively, mixed people are demonized, and are seen as far lesser on account of being mixed. Which it is often depends on the cultural context of the society, and what ethnicities the mixed-race person’s parents are.

Ex: in societies where colourism is prevalent, a child with a darker skin tone is often going to be seen as lesser. Genetics are roulette so being mixed race does not automatically determine what your skin tone will be, but if you end up with two siblings and one is notably darker, the darker skinned parent will often be blamed for it. This often goes into what marriages are approved or disproved, out of fear that the child will end up falling on the “wrong” side of the colourism spectrum.

I’m not mixed in such a way that’s weaponized so I can’t speak to it, but I am just putting a note that this exists. 

It is more than possible to have your villains be people of colour. But if you do that, then make sure they’re not the only member of that group, and make sure the villains are described in such a way that their villainy isn’t emphasized by features white people are seen as not having.

Also, the fact they are possessed can have some very unfortunate implications, either in the form of “these people are weak minded, [insert race trying to paint itself as superior here] would NEVER”, and/or in the form of effectively forcing a colonized people to act as a colonizer.

Which leads me to:

Fae vs. humans… or, “colonialism shorthand”

As the title says. Fae vs humans where humans are trying to invade fae lands is one of the easiest, quickest, and generally most obvious parallels to colonialism you can have. This goes double if you have a particularly forest-y setting, since most people assume North America was “untamed wilderness” before Europeans came and Indigenous people exclusively lived amongst the trees that were haphazardly planted.

Toss in the fact that the culture you’re basing this society off of was heavily influenced by colonized peoples, and the villains of this nation in real life are going to be white. This adds another aspect to “it can be really hard to write PoC villains”: the wrong angle, and you can absolutely paint victims of colonialism as just as bad as the colonizers, when this is not true.

Power dynamics are an important thing to consider, when writing villains. Because a lot of times, most villains are able to be villains because they are dominant in some way. Once you start to have villains be “marginalized people trying to do something to either fight structural inequality or get justice in a system that failed them or escape the system that failed them”, you are punching down. Hard.

So when you look at this spirit, ask yourself: what goals does it have for possessing someone marginalized? Will it be able to accomplish anything this way? Or will it get much farther by taking someone from a dominant culture and possessing them, instead?

The thing about Fae is, they’re already kind of… associated with Indigenous peoples. They have nature magic. They’re often akin to elves in terms of old guardians of the forest, especially in modern fantasy, and elves are heavily Indigenous coded.

On top of that, you’re making your fae analogous to a whole bunch of Indigenous groups (Indigenous Brazilians, Afro-Brazilians) and colonized people (Okinawan)—which makes the parallels more intense. Even if you make it that your Japanese-Brazilians are Yamato Japanese… you then make a colonizer (within Asia) into an Indigenous analogue. It’s going to be tricky.

It’s more than possible to handle this tactfully, but you first need to be aware of the power dynamics that come built into such a plot. The fact you did not indicate anything about the power dynamics on the humans’ side and were instead focused on adding in as many characters of colour as possible tells me that you aren’t aware of these dynamics.

They absolutely need addressing before you can write such a plot or a villain respectfully.

Overall

I think you need to solidly analyze the influences on your work, your goals, and the dynamics at play. Because right now, I’m seeing a huge emphasis on simply wanting to toss in a whole bunch of different skin tones and facial features and “cultures” into a single place, without actually putting in the work to make something realistic or representative of any given peoples except majority Brazilians. 

You’re at a huge risk of punching down in multiple locations, especially in regard to your human characters. Even with your fae, you could very easily wind up disrespecting the people you want to represent, because you are overtly erasing their homelands and not even giving them a name to signal where they came from. 

Diversity is way more than tossing in a bunch of cultures and physical features into a fantasy world. Diversity means representing people, including their immigration status. It’s not a checklist of “oh I should have these people here because then I’m showing I know humans come in different skin tones”. That is how you get tokenism. 

That’s also how you get assimilationist homogeneity, where everything gets shoved into a single culture that’s assumed to just… be this way, without outside influences. It really doesn’t feel good to have your cultural history stripped away because of wanting to show one culture as just being so special that it produced your culture from itself—when it couldn’t have.

This is on top of the fact you’re basically taking a diversity paintbrush to a very assimilationist and pro-colonial work, which is something that seems to have carried over in your worldbuilding. You’re so focused on simply trying to diversify a work with mostly white people that you haven’t asked: could this plot even work with racial diversity at play?

Because the thing about plots where you take down colonialism is: they don’t work unless you use pre-established colonial forces as the villains. And when you’re talking Brazil, those historical villains were primarily the Portugese, who are white.

Diversity isn’t as simple as this.

Your work should reflect that.

~Mod Lesya

Race and Mixed-Ness

It’s unclear to me based on your description whether your Japanese-Brazilian coded character and Polish-Brazilian coded character are monoracial or mixed. It’s strange to me that your last mixed race person is described as “a mixed race like European + Afro + Natives.” Did you mean to describe a Pardo Brazilian and fail to research/locate the appropriate terminology? And furthermore, why is that character described in racial terms and the other two in national terms? 

The reason this ambiguity is an issue is this: what does Brazilian-Japanese look like, racially? The answer: ANYTHING! Brazil/Japan/Poland/etc. is just a designation for a nation-state drawn on colonial borders. It says nothing about how, specifically, its people should look; to suggest that it does is ethnonationalist. 

Following the assumption that your fae are mixed, Mod Lesya is also right about the potential glorification of mixed-ness. I, on the other hand, am the kind of mixed that, in one majority culture, is considered inherently “cooler.” It’s an awkward feeling to know that when passerby explicitly connect my double eyelids or English-ing Good to being hafu, my identity is being leveraged to further some kind of agenda (eg. westernization, pushing of homogeneity through Othering) Don’t make your mixed people part of an agenda, even if you think it’s a well-meaning one (eg. diversity, progress, etc.). 

~Mod Rina

Further Recommendations

I think it’s possible to write a highly mixed race neutral world (e.g. Earthsea Universe, Broken Earth). Ursula LeGuin and N.K. Jemisin have both written extensively on the conscious narrative choices they took for how to handle the issue of race in a manner that subverts notions of racism, but nevertheless draws attention to the variation in human appearance for their characters. To paraphrase another favorite fantasy author of mine: Don’t hesitate to steal from those more talented than you. That said, I agree with Lesya. You can’t code a country like Brazil, where the very fabric of the culture is so interwoven with race relations, colonialism and imperialism, and create a race neutral society without removing lots of what makes Brazil “Brazil.” You are better off using a diverse civilization that existed prior to the onset of race-based imperialism and colonization.

-Marika.

giucorreias

I think op is misunderstanding what Brazil is like. We’re not “just one big mixed culture”. Like. We’re not just one culture at all? Brazil is a huge country, and every state has something different going on. Different food. Different accents. Different history. And different states also have… different names. Northeastern names tend to be very distinct names you don’t find in other regions. Cities with a lot of indigenous influence tend to have a lot of people with indigenous names. And even people who are descendant from immigrants, they keep their original surnames. So they have that connection to their ancestral culture.

When that doesn’t happen. Like, when a culture has been so subsumed by the other that it only shines sometimes through small stuff, that shows that there was a lot of effort to make that culture disappear. Brazil is not a country where different cultures live in harmony- not even our different brazilian cultures. There is a certain bias towards the southeastern way of living, for instance. We have a lot of indigenous massacre, a lot of police brutality towards black people, a lot of racism against asian-brazilians.

I understand what op wants to do, i think. In the sense that like… maybe it’s a place where people of different cultures can live well and in harmony, or maybe that different people can have a single culture. But Brazil is not the example you are looking for, op. For one, even the same city can vary wildly in culture - see for instance the Liberdade neighborhood in São Paulo versus the rest of the city. For another, one culture doesn’t just disappear if they’re not forcefully erased. We have german speaking communities in south brazil, and many children who are born speaking german as their first language. We still have a german dialect that is no longer spoken in germany, but remains in small pockets of communities in Minas Gerais. Also, we have a pretty dark past (and present) full of the western, european culture being imposed upon the others. Even brazilian general culture being imposed upon poor european immigrants.

I think what you need to keep in mind, op, is that without a darker history there wouldn’t be one main culture that was influenced by all the others. It would be like, several different cultures coexisting. And they would influence each other, but they’d still be different cultures at the end of the day.

writingwithcolor

Additional Commentary:

@itismurder says:

My two cents as a Brazilian person: reconsider why you wanna do “fantasy Brazil” in an industry that doesn’t allow Brazilian authors to write “fantasy Brazil”. Brazilians are still giving baby steps regarding publishing our own stories outside of the Brazilian scene: is it appropriate for an American to do it before us? I’d also argue that you cannot really have a “fae” story that really says “Brazil”, considering we don’t usually “do” fairies.

@scila says:

Yeah, I agree with itismurder, profiting off Brazil when Brazilian authors struggle to publish stories about their identity in English fiction is not very nice. Besides, Brazilian culture as a fantasy analog would not work unless you want to set in the Imperial/Colonial era, which was far from a “race neutral” culture. Also the fae is not part of Brazilian folklore.

Please don’t fall for the myth of a racial utopia in Brazil. Yes, we are far more mixed and open to immigrants than Americans, and that’s awesome, but there’s also a lot of racism and racist history, especially toward Afro-Brazilians and Pardos. Immigrants were viewed by some as way to “make Brazil whiter,” for example.

@weirdplutoprince says:

As someone who’s used to seeing brazillian characters having weird hispanic sounding names instead of names and surnames that would be common in brazil, the bit about not using br names sounds particularly annoying to me lol. if i were to read a story with characters said to be brazillian and they were named stuff like john or matthew i’d be mad dsusdfsf also agree with what everyone else said.

Thank you, Brazilian commenters! 

(And thanks for letting me know that Brazil doesn’t really “do” fae and has its own forest spirits. I didn’t know enough about Brazil to feel comfortable saying anything about that aspect of the worldbuilding. ~Lesya)

brazil brazilian diversity multicultural assimilation colonialism racism faeries worldbuilding race commentary
writingwithcolor

Harmful Vietnamese Stereotypes

writingwithcolor

strawbebebby asked:

What are some harmful stereotypes to avoid when writing Vietnamese characters?

Two specifics are Vietnamese names as a whole (see our Hai Chen post with additions from Vietnamese readers) + “Asia is just China/Japan/Korea”. Nothing specifically about Vietnamese people comes to mind, but input from our Vietnamese community would be great. 

Also not necessarily a stereotype about Vietnamese culture, but the mish-mash of Southeast Asia into one monolith in a lot of Western media definitely pertains to Vietnamese representation that I’ve seen! That’s one thing that’s been bugging me with cough a certain animated film released this year cough.

~ Mod Em

Vietnamese followers, feel free to chime in.

writingwithcolor

Harmful Vietnamese Stereotypes (continued, with additions from our Vietnamese readers!)

After our initial post regarding Vietnamese stereotypes went up, we received some feedback and additions from our Vietnamese readers!

Being only part Vietnamese, I’ve also taken the time to speak to a full Vietnamese friend and we both came up with some other Vietnamese-specific tropes to be wary of. Here are some of the highlights from our conversation:

You should be especially careful when putting us in with East Asian and western (especially US and French) characters and/or settings because…

  1. Vietnam has been occupied by both Japan and China, both of which are (as I mentioned above) dominant in the conversation of “Asia” as a whole. While there are some similarities between our cultures, people often conflate every element of these cultures together.
  2. Many Vietnamese women were also sex trafficked to China and Taiwan as slaves and mail order brides during Chinese occupation, as well as comfort women during Japanese occupation. While not a solely Vietnamese stereotype, this definitely relates to Chinese imperialism over Vietnam, and how ESEA women are often objectified in this way and not given autonomy over their bodies. Please also look at our ask about the “East Asian Sex Worker” trope as it applies to Southeast Asians as well, and Mod Lisa’s commentary re: human trafficking/exploitation under the “Filipino and Vietnamese: Tropes to avoid” ask.
  3. Vietnam was a French colony during the period in which France occupied Indochina. With any nation that has been at the hands of colonization, try to avoid any parallels with this very-real event.
  4. The Vietnam War is still a pretty event and it devastated so many Vietnamese families. The US instigated the war as a result of “communist threat” and with the rise of alt-right “dark humor”, it’s often trivialized through jest, which is just disrespectful to those of us who have lost our homes and family members to it.
  5. Coming from a Chinese/Vietnamese perspective, don’t code your Vietnamese characters as "basically Chinese”. A lot of western audiences can’t differentiate between our cultures, and considering the history between Vietnam and China specifically– Vietnamese representation is already marginal, so please put in the effort to make it clear how your character is Vietnamese through culture, language, traditions and whatnot…

Responses

And now for additions and suggestions from our other Vietnamese readers! Thank you all for your insightful feedback, I’ll definitely be making use of all these great points with my own Vietnamese characters!

@chargedarrow said:

Mixed Vietnamese American here! I’ll be the first to admit I’m not the most knowledgeable about Vietnamese culture, but I didn’t see anyone else so I’ll weigh in: the thing I’m most sick of when it comes to finding Vietnamese representation is that the vast majority of it revolves around the war- and even then the most famous pieces of media about it center around White [Americans]

Feelings with Vietnamese people just used as sad backdrops.
It’s just tiring when that’s the ONLY representation that you’re afforded, so I’d recommend avoiding it as I’d much rather read about a Vietnamese character in any other setting. I do think touching on the effects of the Vietnam War can be done well as I’ve yet to meet a Vietnamese person in America who hasn’t been touched by it in some way, but you’d want to work very closely with a Vietnamese person on it.

As for other stereotypes we fall under many of the stereotypes that East Asians do due to being lumped into one monolith, such as being a model minority, submissive brides, All Asians Are Smart, etc. You’d want to research those and how to avoid them for sure.[1]

[1] I’ve linked our model minority, submissive Asian, and smart Asian tags respectively.

@dci-agent-dtle said:

Just considering other names besides “Nguyen” and “Tran” is already a good step forward. There are dozens of last names that rarely show up for Vietnamese characters in media

@mon-ancien-amour said:

Re: names - if you have multiple Vietnamese characters, at least one of them will prob have Nguyen as their last name. In my fairly small friend group, 2 of them are Nguyen. I also have several relatives w/ the family name Nguyen so I personally don’t think it’s a stereotype. Just common.

Other last names you could use: Le, Doan, Do, Tran, Hoang, Dinh, Vu, Vo, Phan, Pham

@tuyetnhip said:

This is something to keep in mind when making Viet Characters (I’m speaking as a Mixed Vietnamese person with both of my parents are from Vietnam).

I would not see much reference of the Vietnam war in contemporary media. There’s already a lot of material that covers it plus its still not out of the minds of my family/community. Generational trauma is a thing so I rather not see it or is mentioned to a minimum.

No joke names. Too many experiences of Viet Americans and diaspora having their name ridiculed to the bone. I rather have such names being dealt with someone who is Vietnamese, working with someone who is Vietnamese, and taken extensive research on Vietnamese names/culture/etc.

This is another thing I’ve seen western media but the Miss Saigon inspired trope/plot? Do not do that.

We aren’t just…Vietnamese. We have other interests. Defy common Asian stereotypes and not just the baseline stereotypes that is lumped together with most Asian ethnicities. We have our similarities and distinctions.

Once again, a huge thanks to our Vietnamese readers for helping out on this one! Feel free to add on with your own observations that are specific to Vietnamese characters (relative to Asian representation in general).

~ Mod Emme

commentary Vietnamese stereotypes tropes names Asian names Asian Southeast Asian fetishization Vietnam war Vietnamese history imperialism TW war crimes TW Japanese imperialism TW Chinese imperialism TW trafficking colonialism Vietnamese Stereotypes Asks
writingwithcolor

chefwhatnot asked:

A tactic I'm using in the worldbuilding of the story I'm writing is to take inspiration for cultural aspects from multiple different real-world countries to avoid the trope of "(Insert country here), only magic". For example, there is a country with dark-skinned humans who speak something linguistically similar to French and with a political history inspired by China. Is this ok? Are there any things I need to watch out for? I'm aware that reducing cultures to a few elements can be harmful.

writingwithcolor answered:

Fantasy France-China (French language, China political history)

I’ll be covering the Chinese portion of this ask, and Rina the linguistics.

When I see “political history inspired by China” the first things that come to mind are Chinese imperialism and dynasties. For starters, you should check out our post on culture-blending for additional support in writing this.

Chinese Imperialism

Chinese imperialism and colonization is still imperialism and colonization. Even as POC, we’re still responsible for the genocide and suffering of countless numbers of marginalized people. 

Some elements of Chinese Imperialism I encourage you to research:

  • Genocide (& Ethnic cleansing)– including ethnic groups of Vietnam, Korea, Central Asia, and modern examples including Hong Kongese, Tibetan, Taiwanese and Uighur people.
  • Chinese nationalism! The Boxer Rebellion, Opioid Wars, Sino-Japanese Wars.. The repercussions of these events are all still huge in Chinese politics today.
  • Jess adds: “there’s a thing that’s been going on for a while to make Mandarin the only dialect spoken/promoted at the expense of others… back in the day in Taiwan they discouraged/forbade Taiwanese being spoken in certain places like schools and only taught in Mandarin.”

Differences between Dynasty / Time Period

You have to do research on the specific dynasty that you’re drawing influence from. The Yuan dynasty ruled by Mongolians? The Qing dynasty ruled by Manchus? China’s political history is huge and just as any civilization, we have different eras that all had different laws, rulers, relations, etc.

(And as always, feedback and input from our Chinese readers would be appreciated– and input from those who have been impacted by Chinese imperialism as well!)

~ Mod Emme

Conlanging

On a quick conlanging note, it’s very theoretically and logically possible for any world to have a language that has a French phonetic inventory, but I would strongly recommend distancing yourself from French in every other aspect as much as possible. 

That includes: 

  • changing the orthography (French has a pretty distinct system of denoting vowel quality with diacritics, but these representations aren’t 1:1 with the IPA and are by no means the only way of romanization that’s out there, so you can and should be flexible in your own fictional language)
  • Changing morphology (I dunno, make it agglutinative like many Germanic languages do, that might be fun! Or look at what kinds of affixes can be attached to French noun and verb stems and do something else!)
  • Changing basic word order (French uses way more combinations than English, but its main construction is SVO, like many Romance languages, so maybe pick something else! Research the typology of word order to see possible real-world combinations)
  • Changing other grammar (like types of noun and verb marking. One very easy way to make it un-French-y is to not mark nouns with gender)
  • And lastly: this depends on both your worldbuilding and how much you plan to use the language in the story, but being loose as heck with vocabulary and adding borrowings/calques from other languages in your fictional world has the added bonus of pissing off the linguistically conservative Académie Française (basically a committee of people who think they have to protect the “purity” of the language). 

Obligatory linking of my naming language conlang guide here. If your readers recognize it as French-y, you’ve done something wrong; see Emme’s discussion above! 

~Mod Rina

writingwithcolor

We realize our post may need further clarification on why the explicit associations with French need to be weakened, and why this blend of cultures should be reconsidered. @chefwhatnot​ Please read for more info! 

@erenaeoth says:

I am not an expert at all, but I feel like some discussion of French colonialism and racism is also relevant here, and that OP might need to look into the historical oppression of Black French people, and French-speaking Black people in ex-French colonies to avoid being insensitive.

@theoneandonlypanya says: 

in china many differant provinces all have differant dialects of the chinese language. Although madarin is accepted and mandated as the “official language” everyone has their separate accents and slang. for an example, in chengdu where my moms family is from, they speak the sichuanses dialect of chinese, and many of the words are not even the same. so linguistically it would be difficult to write.

Excellent points! Will be adding both of them below. 

@squirmaphrodite says:

“If your readers recognize it as French-y, you’ve done something wrong” refers to Emme’s discussion, but this doesn’t really expand in any way on the issue of French or the actual reasons why one wouldn’t want to make a French-y conlang.

I agree, and I apologize for the logical gap! Sometimes when Mods collaborate on a post, the final draft isn’t jointly reviewed/queued, and in this case some time had passed since the completion of both of our drafts. Mod Emme and I wrote up our responses separately in the drafting stage, and it appears I’d referenced a part of Emme’s notes (in addition to their link to How To Blend Cultures) that did not surface in the final draft.

I assume that the remainder of your points on your reblog were partly due to the missing context (which is why I cut them, as I’d hate to misrepresent you, for example) Hopefully this helps:

~ Mod Rina

A Rundown of the Issues That Need to be Considered (aka. what could go wrong if you make this blend obvious?)

  • The characteristics of a language are informed by typological probabilities, language contact, and local geography (this can really change vocabulary and even the writing system!). As stated in the original post, it’s possible to start a conlang with one language as a template, but you need to consider: what makes French look and sound French? What’s motivating your choices in spelling/writing your fictional language? What do you mean by “linguistically similar?” 
  • As a friendly follower mentioned, China is made up of many many languages, so it may not be the best idea to squash this diversity into a single language (especially not one that calls to mind one of the more conservative languages out there). Making it seem like a China-like nation does not really have linguistic diversity will perpetuate IRL oppressive narratives on the status of languages in China. 
  • You’re dealing with two different brands of imperialism/colonialism, and both have problems with antiblackness (per another friendly follower), so it may ring hollow to place dark-skinned people as heads of state of such a colonial system (think about what we’ve discussed re: BIPOC cops and how they don’t champion diversity as much as people think). 
  • Trace your logic as to why you want this particular mix. Did you combine them precisely because their mixing seems implausible? Consider all the ways in which France and China have historically interacted (eg. including xenophobic foreign policy, the Second Opium War) to imagine the implications of a Chinese-like people speaking a French-like language. 

Note that none of this is a problem if people can’t identify your fictional country as being a mix of French and Chinese. Your goal should really be to make your worldbuilding unrecognizable (including making your Frenchy language not as Frenchy). 

France China French Chinese Chinese history politics political history Chinese imperialism Ethnic cleansing tw conlang conlanging language culture culture blending culture mixing colonialism commentary
writingwithcolor

loversarcanas asked:

Im writing a short story involving a butch/femme couple - femme is mixed race while butch is black and uses he/him or they/them pronouns. I've tried to be careful as to not portray my butch as aggressive (he is playful, energetic, rarely gets angry, etc) but my questions are - as a nonblack person, how to avoid desexualizing them (specifically butch, bc i know that is a prominent problem still in the lgbt community), or portraying butch as an unhealthily masculine character? Thank you v much!

writingwithcolor answered:

Black Butch & Femme couple, avoiding desexualizing

I’m not Black, but I am a lesbian of color in the butch/femme community. I’m not going to speak much on this, because Black wlw experiences aren’t something I’ve ever experienced, but I do know a lot of the time wlwoc are often placed in a more masculine/ag/dom role in relationships when dating a white person, as racial bias often sees women of color as more aggressive or angrier than white women. Since the femme you mention is mixed, I think you could avoid that, but there is a trope that comes to mind where the feminine, delicate character is often more light-skinned than the masculine character–again attaching characteristics subconsciously to skin tone. Something to keep in mind.

–Sophia

I agree with Sophia, while the butch can obviously be Black, try not to play into very overly masculine stereotypes because that is also a damaging trope associated with women with darker skin. Since butch uses he/they pronouns and is the darker one in the relationship, even though the femme is mixed, if the femme has the more socially desired eurocentric features, this could fall into the trope of light woman/dark man or partner. I would just try not to portray the butch as overly masculine. That is, in a way as though he/they are trying to prove something, as that an issue in both the Black community as Black men, especially the youth, are often pressured into being the most masculine they can be (very toxic). 

— Acacia

writingwithcolor

As a courtesy to any former mods who cannot address follower feedback, we do not post any commentary for posts that they were a part of. However, please check the notes for this post for insightful commentary!

—WWC

commentary callouts
evening-rose-309

casenpoint asked:

I have a plot point where the group needs to seek counsel from their friend immediately, but because of how the plot is laid, they would theoretically be interrupting her during Shabbat dinner due to the urgency of the matter. I also have a Muslim character. Can they be discussing the urgent issue while eating together and if so, is there anything the Muslim character would not do/eat in accordance with his religion? No meat I think? Or should they just meet outside/not eat?

writingwithcolor answered:

Interrupted by friends during Shabbat dinner, emergency | Also the Muslim diet

I have to research this because I think there’s some overlap between halal and kosher but I can’t remember in which direction (edited later: kashrut seems to be stricter.) 

I’d be okay with the interruption, especially if it involves something life or death – especially bc “but it’s Shabbat!” illustrates how urgent the urgent matter is.

–Shira

So, I’m pretty sure kosher food is halal. I went to a Jewish primary school with a lot of Muslim students, and I remember that many Muslim parents liked that they didn’t have to worry about the food there. Also, when I eat with my Muslim friends I can’t have their food but I’m very used to knowing what kind of snacks I can pick up easily that don’t rely on having kosher cutlery and crockery available. Glass is always kosher which is a very useful loophole, i.e. your Muslim character can have a glass plate and cup that they use for their food, put in their dishwasher etc and their Jewish friend can still use it. Hope that makes sense.

I’m also fine with Shabbat dinner being interrupted for something urgent. I’m sure everyone who keeps Shabbat regularly will have experienced that at some point. OP, you might want to look up the concept of pikuach nefesh, which is kind of an overriding principle of protecting life at the expense of other Torah commandments.

-Shoshi

I just looked this up. Here’s a Muslim page explaining that kosher meat is usually considered halal, although not everyone agrees:

Is Kosher Meat Halal? A Comparison of the Halakhic and Shar’i Requirements for Animal Slaughter

–Shira

The Muslim portion of this character is open to followers. 

Muslim mods are not active at this time. We’ll be recruiting for more mods soon; Muslim writers, feel free to apply anytime! 

https://forms.gle/qywJmrwcZj3E28nh8

evening-rose-309

Things Muslims are not allowed to eat, according to Surat Al-Maidah : 3 and other things:

  1. Pork - this one you've probably heard of. The reasoning for this (besides the science that I can't really prove because I am 90% sure it's pseudo science) is that pig meat is roughly the most similar kind of meat to human flesh, meaning to eat it would be similar to commiting cannibalism. There's an incident mentioned in the Quran where a bunch of guys did something they weren't supposed to and got turned into, well, pigs and monkeys. That and the general consensus of 'pigs eat anything and everything' which is sort of true given the fact that pigs can eat their own shit if they wanted and have you seen Red Dead Redemption 2? Bodies in the pig pen? Yeah, they aren't opposed to people either, you get the picture.
  2. Corpses - what do I mean by this? Anything rotted. Meet that is not preserved and therefore has rotted.
  3. Anything that has died from falling, being crushed, stabbed, part eaten, left over or previously hunted by an animal that wasn't a designated hunting animal, i.e. eagles, falcons, and dogs.
  4. Anything with claws - predators, like aforementioned dogs, birds of prey, bears, lions, wolves, ect.
  5. Anything that wasn't slaughtered in God's name - this is flexible. Mostly. Because we can eat things that weren't slaughtered by having their heads decapitated by a very sharp knife (to reduce the suffering and make it quick) facing the direction of Ka'bah or the kiblat. I think this might also refer to, you know, a sadistic killing or killing for the sake of one's own mad pleasure?
  6. Animals that were slaughtered in sacrifice to another god.
  7. Animals that live simultaneously on two planes - meaning both land and water, i.e. frogs, toads, salamanders(?).
  8. Blood - just....no. That means black pudding, blood broth, and the likes are a no go. If it's like residue on a piece of cooked meat, it's okay (the cooks at my school would occasionally miss a spot inside the meat) but we try to avoid it.

Exceptions are made though. All of the above will be considered halal and their consumption forgiven under the dire circumstances of: there is nothing else/ famine, you have tried all you could, you are starving/dying and you know what? Self preservation matters more than the rules because even if you do sin, it's better to do that and live than to die knowing you could have survived to live another day. You can always ask for forgiveness after (tobat), the main thing is that you did it for survival and most people wouldn't harangue you for it if you mention/explain the circumstances.

Also: fish? Sharks? Sea urchins? All fair game. Everything, and I mean everything, under the sea that lives there 24/7 7 days a week 365 days in the year is all Halal. Sea turtles I'm not quite sure, but just to be safe, avoid them because they might fall under category 6 just for hatching on land and coming up every few seasons to lay their eggs. Other than that, well, go ahead.

But just because you can, doesn't mean you should. There's a hadits (which are like collections of anecdotes or tips people have received from the Prophet Muhammad S.A.W or things people have seen him doing, all of which much be fact checked and traced to their origin with background checks before they can be declared, well, actually true and usable) and verses that warn not to overindulge in anything lest you know, you become a glutton and take food away from people who should also have it.

Disclaimer though, some of the things up here will have varying degrees of people actually conforming to them depending on, well, culture. Now mind, sometimes islam is it's own culture, but most of it derives from the middle east. After the Prophet died and his friends expanded the religion outwards outside of the middle east, sometimes they had to negotiate and mingle with other cultures in order to be excepted. In Indonesia, if you came in ala crusade we would have beat your asses flat in good old 600, which is why the Sunans spread the religion through art and education like math and things as well as human rights instead of more....direct methods. They mingled, they adapted, and some rules were bent whilst other things became intertwined and redesigned to fit the culture. That be Asia. So you know, research a bit if you want muslims who originate a bit further east to the sea because let me tell you there are a LOT of things we deviated from from the older Islamic teachings. Not in too big ways, but details.

Sorry if, again, this isn't coherent or I missed anything. These are just my takes, as a moderate Muslim in a Southeast Asian community.

{Also also; alcohol? I had a teacher once say it depends on whether the intent was to get drunk or for something else. If you must for propriety's sake, like my mom in her corporate days drinking the occasional scotch with the Big Shots because Lawyer™, or in general respect of a culture that is very insistent on it, then, again, go, you can always ask for forgiveness after - heck, you can give God the 'I am so sorry' face internally as you're drinking and I'm sure our almighty all seeing creator won't give you hell for it. At least, I think so.}

Oh, and eating utensils/accoutrements? As long as they're clean and made from sensible materials (i.e. not compounded camel shit or crusted in dried blood or anything as fantastically gross as those), they're fine, we can eat from them. You guys mentioned glass plates and I smiled a little because we used to eat with glass plates all the time. They're used practically everywhere, most times in lower end restaurants that cater more to traditional food and lower income people, though overtime I think porcelain became more favorable - and plastic, because durability.

Hope this was helpful 🙏🏻

writingwithcolor

Commentary, continued:

Shabbat dinner

@terulakimban​

Am Jewish, not Muslim, but with a Shabbat dinner specifically, in addition to the debate about whether kosher meat is inherently halal or not, the Muslim character might run into problems with alcohol. Assuming a Jewish character who keeps kosher and is some level of shomer Shabbat, they will have probably said kiddush (ritual blessing over wine) before eating (you could also use this to hint at how well the characters know each other, based on whether the Jewish character offers the Muslim character a glass or doesn’t); if they’re eating a roast or something like tzimmes, it may have been cooked with some wine as well (same point about which food is offered/warned and using that to show familiarity or lack of it). Dessert is another thing to watch out for -vanilla extract is at least 35% alcohol (although the artificial kind can be alcohol-free), and it’s in almost everything unless you specifically use artificial or vanilla sugar instead.

No restrictions on the Jewish side from discussing serious things over shabbat; if the issue is big enough, there’s also no problem with saying “I’m sorry, but lives are at stake” and doing what needs doing right then and there.

Muslim diet

@voidgremlin​
Kosher food is considered as halal because it is produced by people of the book, they have rituals close to ours and it’s accepted mostly. (Interpretation can varies depending to the scholar) So they can eat what their Jewish friend is eating without worry.
The rule is no pork, no alcohol. Meat has to be prepared Halal (or Kosher)
Usually if people need to eat out, they stick with veggies option or any kind of fish option.

@thehlaalueffect​
In any case, in practice, kosher meals are an absolutely appropriate alternative for Muslims in countries where they are discriminates against or very marginalised and halal food is barely accessible/doesn’t exist. Also note that many behavior laws within Islamic scripture are fairly flexible when it comes to Muslims who do not live in a Muslim majority country. Some Muslims might prefer a vegetarian alternative when they cannot be sure about it.

@bigwigs
seconding @evening-rose-309​ ! re: what meat is halal, i was taught that if the animal eats meat, it isn’t (with the exception being fish, which is) — and obv it has to be slaughtered in the appropriate way. kosher food is considered acceptable. alcohol used in food is also probably okay since most of it would evaporate in the cooking process, but obv super boozy desserts or whatever are not strictly allowed.

thank you! muslim Jewish Shabbat kosher halal food diet commentary
evening-rose-309

nukeli asked:

Would a jewish or muslim person pray if they were in a dire, hopeless situation and thinking they were going to die? If so, what would they say?

writingwithcolor answered:

Jewish and Muslim characters - what would they pray in a dire situation?

Jewish answer

“Hear, Oh Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is One / Blessed is God’s Glorious Name For Ever and Ever” (Shma Yisrael, Adonai Eloheinu, Adonai Echad / Baruch Shem, K’vod Malchuto, L’Olam Va’ed) – this is the shema, there are plenty of times to say it and this is just one of them. My flippant way of describing it in my head is that if we’re mobile phones this is the way we ping the tower.

–Shira

Definitely agree it would be the Shema. 

The only exception I can think of is if it’s the time of day for ritualistic prayer (either shacharit, mincha or ma'ariv), they might prioritise that over reacting to the situation as an affirmation of their faith in face of death. There is no obligation to risk your/others’ lives in order to pray at the correct time, in fact this would be against Torah, but if the situations seems hopeless anyway then I can think of some stories of people saying ‘it’s time for *insert daily prayer*’ and proceeding to go through the relevant service with no obvious signs of fear. 

Similarly, you might want to research how to make sure your character’s attitude towards the situation is in line with their unique Jewish identity.

If they’re very religious, for example, they may have an easier time accepting this fate than the average person. Jewish theology involves a belief that everything ultimately comes from G-d and is therefore good. We do have a strong emphasis on protecting life as one of our main obligations in this world, but there is also an acceptance towards death as something that G-d created and so is ultimately for the good - the first thing we say on hearing that someone has passed away is 'Baruch Dayurn Ha'Emet’, 'Blessed is the True Judge.’

 Unlike Christianity, we don’t have a concept of the Devil as a being independent of G-d who is capable of introducing fundamentally bad things into the universe. This may or may not play out in your character’s thought process and decisions in the situation you’re describing, it depends on their relationship to Judaism and Jewish theology, so that’s something I recommend including in your research.

–Shoshi

As you can see, Shoshi and I have varying levels of knowledge about how much prayer belongs when, and that’s something to keep in mind – if your character is Reform they might sound more like my answer and if they’re Orthodox go with Shoshi’s – but that difference is only relevant at specific times of the day.

–Shira

Muslim answer - open to followers

The Muslim portion of this character is open to followers.

Muslim mods are not active at this time. We’ll be recruiting for more mods soon; Muslim writers, feel free to apply anytime! 

https://forms.gle/qywJmrwcZj3E28nh8

evening-rose-309

Southeast Asian Muslim here

Like all the replies before me have stated, the most likely thing to happen is your character recite the syahadat ("there is no other God than Allah, I testify that Muhammad SAW is his messenger" [rough translation from what my language translates it as]) over and over. We're gonna need specifics for what sort of dire situation you're in because, well, we have doas/prayers for just about everything under the sun.

Now, if you were about to die? Lots of teaching will tell you what to recite, but the one thing most people will urge their family members on their death beds is to recite the line: "laa ilaha illallah" which is the first half of the syahadat. If your body has gone stiff and you can do literally nothing else, this line is not only the most 'practical' (according to my teacher, I went to a school for this stuff) because it requires no other movement than the tongue and air for all the 'h's, but it's memorable and easily repeatable.

Again, the above is death bed level 'you are about to meet the angel of death oh look they're right there' stuff. If you're on a sinking ship? About to crash into an asteroid? The other replies have mentioned repeating the syahadat; 'sujud' which is bowing with your forehead, hands, and knees and tips of your toes flat on the ground 'kising' it; ayat kursi, which is also good against malevolent spirits/entities and general protection against anything that might crawl into your dreams as you sleep; and dzikir, which are, like, three verses that all mention God in some way that most muslims recite after every one of our daily prayers/sholat. Those would be go-tos for most people, the Al-Fatihah verse as well because it's one of the most used surahs in the Quran and is the first verse anyone teaches their children and is used in, well, basically everything.

Sorry if this isn't as coherent (kinda hard to explain a few things because I've been taught them in my language and for some reason English tends to make harmless words in Indonesian sound evil or some shit, I don't know, I hate it) or detailed as the others. I live in a fairly moderate household despite going to a Muslim boarding school, so my day to day has kinda diluted the more detailed things I've been taught(?) and so I'm kinda lax on a few things. Kinda sad that I tend to forget important bits when I'm at home, but I hope this helps.

mrsq8geek

This!  Adding that the general dua for any misfortune is “ina lillahi wa inna ilayhi raji’un” -- which roughly translates as “we belong to God and to him we return”, here it is in the Quran if it helps.  Note that this dua is applicable for everything, from, say, you failed a test or didn’t get the job you want, to your parent just died or your country was invaded.

From the context, it sounds like there might be an offending party about to kill them?  If that’s the case, there are also many duas for tyranny and injustice.

evening-rose-309

I'm not familiar with the tyranny and injustice ones (either that or they slipped past me in school) but yeah innalilahi wa innailaihi raji'un is a pretty common one to use in harrowing situations or if you hear a person has recently passed. Another is 'anuzubillah min dzalik' which is used mostly like a 'dear God no' or 'please let that not happen to me' sort of thing.

writingwithcolor

More Muslim Commentary

@cinnnamonrollstan said:
A Muslim would probably recite the shahada/ testimony of faith. Which basically translates to: I testify that there is no God but God and Muhammad is his messenger.

@polarissdiary said:
A Muslim would say the shahada (testimony of faith) and if they can, they would pray what we call two rak'at. Since we are closer to Allah with our foreheads on the floor, they would say any dua'a (supplication) in that position, from asking for forgivenes to asking for mercy. This in case there is no escape for them. If there is a chance to break free or save themselves, as Muslims they have the obligation to put they’re trust in Allah and at least try. Hope it helps 🖤

@bloomiii said:
Hello! I am a practicing Muslim.

A Muslim character might definitely pray in a dire situation. It doesn’t have to be any specific prayer. This could be in any language and even just in your own thoughts.

If you want a character to recite something specific, they might recite a certain part of the Qur’an (one thing I often recite to myself when I am anxious is aayat al-kursi, which is a very holy part of the Qur’an, that you recite for protection) or a specific dua (thats the arabic word for prayer). There are duas for specific things, such as one dua to recite when traveling that Muslims might recite when driving.

Jewish Commentary

@beautifullights1  said:
Some Jews, esp those who are less familiar with the traditional liturgy, less fluent in Hebrew, and/or from a progressive denomination, might pray in a more freeform way. For example, they might have a conversation with Gd or plead for Gd’s help in their own language.

@addiehour​ said:
just wanted 2 say i’m orthodox & agree w shira!

Thanks for all the great answers, everyone!

commentary Jewish Muslim prayer