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Judge Drops Cases Against Comey & James, DOJ Vows to Appeal; Pentagon Investigates Sen. Mark Kelly over Controversial Video; Are Kids Getting Too Much Screen Time at School? Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired November 25, 2025 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BRIAN ABEL, CNN ANCHOR: Crystal ball will be dropped in New York's Times Square this year to ring in 2026. The ball, unveiled Monday, has almost 5,300 Waterford crystals. That's nearly twice as many as the last one. It also has circular crystals for the first time.

[06:00:17]

This is only the ninth time the ball has been updated since the tradition back in 1907. Looking forward to seeing that.

Thank you for joining us here on EARLY START. I'm Brian Abel in Washington. CNN THIS MORNING with Audie starts right now.

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Cases dismissed. But this isn't the end of President Trump's retribution campaign. His latest target this morning.

CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES COMEY, FORMER FBI DIRECTOR: I know that Donald Trump will probably come after me again.

SEN. MARK KELLY (D-AZ): I'm not going to be silenced. I'm not going to be intimidated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, two indictments were thrown out while another probe is just beginning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was a surrender to Russia. It was an abomination, in my -- in my view.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Kyiv under assault. U.S. officials sit down with Russia. Does the peace plan put Ukraine in an impossible position?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: I have concepts of a plan.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Fourteen months ago, candidate Trump had concepts of a plan on health care. Now, as president, he's delaying releasing those concepts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's the Chromebooks. The Chromebooks ruined education.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Technology has transformed the classroom. But is too much screen time at school helping or hurting?

Six a.m. here on the East Coast. This is a live look at the damage in Kyiv from a Russian strike that happened overnight as a peace plan is still up for debate. I'm going to be speaking to the U.S. former ambassador to Ukraine, coming up.

Good morning, everybody. It's Tuesday, November 25th. I want to thank you for waking up with me. I'm Audie Cornish, and here is where we begin.

The Trump administration now vowing to appeal not one, but two dismissed criminal cases against his political foes.

So, a federal judge ruled that the indictments against former FBI director Jim Comey and New York Attorney General Letitia James were unlawful. The judge says that she had to, after finding that the interim U.S. attorney, former Trump attorney Lindsey Halligan, had been illegally appointed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL: We believe we will be successful on appeal. And I'll tell you: Lindsey Halligan. I talk to all of our U.S. attorneys, the majority of them around the country, and Lindsey Halligan is an excellent U.S. attorney, and shame on them for not wanting her in office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, the former FBI director, James Comey, says the ruling is proof of a politicized DOJ. The White House is warning him not to get too comfortable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COMEY: I know that Donald Trump will probably come after me again, and my attitude is going to be the same. I'm innocent. I am not afraid. And I believe in an independent federal judiciary, the gift from our founders that protects us from a would-be tyrant. (END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Joining me now, two former federal prosecutors: Alyse Adamson and Ankush Khardori. Thank you so much for being here.

So first, I want to start with what the judge had to say. She wrote this, that "Miss Halligan had no lawful authority to even present the indictment" and said that "all actions flowing from that defective appointment, including securing, signing the indictment, constitute unlawful exercises of executive power and must be set aside."

And then this is the part I wanted to bring to you: "There is simply no alternative course to cure the unconstitutional problem." Help me translate -- Ankush.

ANKUSH KHARDORI, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: There is no mechanism for them to fix the problem that they created here. The U.S. attorney was unconstitutionally installed, illegally installed, as the court concluded yesterday.

There was an attempt by the attorney general to, like, retroactively ratify her actions. I won't bore you with the details.

CORNISH: Meaning calling her a special attorney?

KHARDORI: Yes, exactly. Trying to fix, essentially, that -- the mistake that they had made. And the court basically said, you cannot do that. There's no legal basis for you to do that here. So, this is a mess entirely of the administration's own making. It's very, very embarrassing, I have to say, as sort of a professional legal matter. This was entirely avoidable if they had just installed Halligan under a different statutory framework.

And honestly, I think, you know, what James Comey said yesterday, that the case against him is -- in his view, reflects malevolence and incompetence, I think is pretty well-justified at this point.

CORNISH: Can you talk about this incompetence part of it? I know, Alyse, you have been very critical of Halligan's performance.

Could a more competent attorney general fix what is sloppy work if they put in someone, get them through the Senate? If they actually went through the process, could they actually have a case?

[06:05:06]

ALYSE ADAMSON, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Well, I think you hit the nail on the head right there, Audie. If they actually went through the process.

Because what happened here was that the DOJ attempted to circumvent the senatorial power -- authority of advice and consent. Right?

So, to your question specifically, if they were to lawfully appoint a U.S. attorney, could they re-bring these cases? I think they could certainly re-bring the case against Letitia James. There is a question now about whether or not James Comey's case is time-barred.

There's also a question about the strength of these cases.

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: Because the reporting indicated that they weren't brought in the first place, because prosecutors didn't believe that they could win.

So, I would argue a truly competent prosecutor would not have indicted these cases in the first place.

DOJ guidance is that you shouldn't indict a case unless you have a likelihood of success on the merits at trial. And just looking at the evidence, at least what's been reported, it's not strong. They don't have that likelihood of success.

So, that's how I would answer, quite frankly.

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: That in ordinary times, through an ordinary process, these cases wouldn't have been brought in the first place.

CORNISH: Let me play something for you. Pam Bondi -- or the White House has been talking about what they want to do next. They're not done. That's period. They're just not done. Regardless of what you guys are saying. Here's what they had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: This judge took an unprecedented action to throw these cases out to shield James Comey and Letitia James from accountability, based on a technical ruling, and the administration disagrees with that technical ruling.

And I know the Department of Justice will be appealing this in very short order. So, maybe James Comey should pump the brakes on his victory lap.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: And then I want to add one more. Ty Cobb, a former Trump White House attorney, has been talking a lot about what he sees is going on here. Here was his take on that idea of a technicality.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TY COBB, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE LAWYER: It's like, you know, saying that it's technically wrong to run a red light. You know, I mean, the reality is it's wrong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: One thing it does, though, is because it's a technicality, can people say like, look, the deep state interfered here somehow? This is not a case that was thrown out against these folks on its merits. Like, does it kind of contribute to that argument?

ADAMSON: Can I just say this is not a technicality. The court ruled that the appointment was unlawful based -- based on the law and also the Constitution.

So, I agree with Ty Cobbs' position, where it's kind of silly to say it's a technicality when there was a constitutional violation.

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: Like you said, sure, they didn't reach the merits of the case, but they didn't have to because, in bringing the case, they violated the Constitution. This -- this was not the result of a partisan judge. This was a case about statutory interpretation. And --

CORNISH: Let me bring in Ankush, then, just for the last word, which is that fundamentally, people thought the guardrails with -- of the law -- how prosecutors operate the rules -- would prevent them from being sort of bent to the will of these political whims.

Are we seeing in these last few months that that is just not the case?

KHARDORI: Well, I mean, I think we're seeing a couple of things.

First, I know you're going to be talking about the situation with Mark Kelly later in the hour. I think that partly reflects an effort for them -- by the administration to move some of these cases out of independent jurisdiction forums and into executive branch-only forums, where they effectively control the outcome.

Because, yes, I think in some of these cases, particularly yesterday, the courts have been sort of providing the requisite guardrails.

This particular issue, I mean, it is definitely not a technicality. It's a very, very serious issue. And I think it is really, really unfortunate and damaging for the attorney general to go out attacking the judge.

CORNISH: Yes.

KHARDORI: For the press secretary to go out attacking the judge, saying that, you know -- Bondi said, oh, how dare they, you know, not want her in place.

This is about their own ineptitude. And the fact that they cannot take accountability for anything, including when they screw up their own cases, is really, really unfortunate. And it is -- I think it undermines confidence in the criminal justice system.

CORNISH: All right, you guys, thank you both for explaining this to me, talking it through. I appreciate you.

Coming up on CNN THIS MORNING, DOGE is done, but it is leaving behind a devastating impact, especially on USAID.

Plus, we'll have an update on civil rights leader Jesse Jackson after a health scare.

And this retribution campaign continues. Senator Mark Kelly facing a Pentagon investigation after telling military members they don't have to follow unlawful orders. And of course, we know the group chat's going to have thoughts about that. They're coming with us next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is crossing the Rubicon. This is going to a space we've never gone before. The idea you can drag him back onto active duty and threaten court martial, which I don't think he has any grounds to do, but the fact that he's threatening to do it is breaking glass that's never been broken before in the modern military.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:14:41]

CORNISH: So, the Trump administration has a new list of people to focus on as it ramps up attacks on its political foes.

Senator Mark Kelly, a retired U.S. Navy captain, the Pentagon now says they are going to be launching a thorough review into Kelly.

This follows after the president accused Kelly and other Democratic lawmakers of seditious behavior, punishable by death, over a video in which they urged service members in this way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLY: Our laws are clear. You can refuse illegal orders.

SEN. ELISSA SLOTKIN (D-MI): No one has to carry out orders that violate the law --

REP. CHRISSY HOULAHAN (D-PA): -- or our Constitution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, in a statement, the Pentagon cited serious allegations of misconduct against Kelly. Kelly spent 25 years in the Navy and is in a -- and is a former NASA astronaut.

And he is vowing to fight back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLY: So, I'm not going to be silenced. I'm not going to be intimidated. We wanted to just remind folks that they need to comply with the law and be reminded.

And also explain to members of the military that we have their backs.

(END VIDEO CLIP) CORNISH: Joining me now in the group chat, Gabby Birnbaum, Washington correspondent at "The Texas Tribune"; Ashley Davis, former George W. Bush White House official; and Maria Cardona, CNN political commentator.

So, just to remind people, the other lawmakers who were in this video -- Elissa Slotkin, Jason Crow -- all of these folks had some kind of military or sort of law enforcement background. One was a former CIA analyst, a former Army Ranger.

Apparently, Kelly was vulnerable, because he was a retired officer. It was about his particular status. And I'm wondering for you, Maria, how are -- did people kind of not think all the way through the risks here in terms of this video? Like, how do they see this moment -- response from the White House?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, I think they absolutely thought this through and were very methodical and focused on doing it. Because imagine the possibility that the president of the United States, the commander in chief, gives an order to, if the military is in the midst of an American city, to attack Americans.

Imagine the commander in chief gives an order to attack fishermen in the ocean, when you have absolutely no clue and no evidence that those people are involved in any wrongdoing.

This stuff is actually within the realm of possibility, because of --

CORNISH: But it was the idea that Mark Kelly --

CARDONA: -- because of what we have been seeing.

CORNISH: -- can bear the brunt of this, because this is a pretty serious response.

And I want to ask you, Ashley, is this something that they feel the Pentagon is actually going to sign, get underway, do the process of court martial? Or does this keep an issue in the air and in the conversation?

ASHLEY DAVIS, FORMER GEORGE W. BUSH WHITE HOUSE OFFICIAL: I don't know if they'll actually sign the paperwork. I wouldn't put them past them for doing it.

But I see where you're going is, Like, none of the others are going to -- if there is any trouble to get in, the others aren't going to.

CORNISH: But he's a decorated war hero, right? And so, he's --

DAVIS: He's the only one because of --

CORNISH: -- the guy. Whereas your regular service members, it's much harder for any of them to come forward with any concerns they would have.

DAVIS: Absolutely. So, he may take the fall. If there is a fall to take place, he may take the fall.

I think what the interesting dynamic is on both sides here is Senator Kelly is raising a ton of money in regards to what he's doing, kind of speaking up for -- for the left on this. And I think the administration feels the more that they're stirring up this story, it is the better for them, because they're kind of getting their -- not kind of. They're getting their base riled up.

So, it's -- both sides are feeling that this is a beneficial conversation.

CARDONA: I don't actually think Senator Kelly's concerned that they're going to go through with this or that this will actually happen because of two things.

The political pushback and then the actual legality of this actually --

CORNISH: Let's talk about political pushback for a second, because Kelly actually has commented on the fact that there hasn't -- it's kind of crickets from Congress, so to speak.

Here's how he described it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLY: We've heard very little -- basically, crickets from Republicans in the United States Congress -- about what the president has said about hanging members of Congress. I've heard them say, you know, very little about this.

I think, you know, the president tries to intimidate them. He tries to intimidate Congress. He looks at government accountability as a nuisance.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Yes.

CARDONA: I think --

CORNISH: Let me let Ashley talk about that.

DAVIS: I do think that you did see the speaker last week, and you did see, you know, some senators go up and -- and Senator Thune, as well. Leader Thune, that was kind of like, I don't like the rhetoric.

So, yes, I mean, there wasn't a full pushback against it. I mean, but it was I don't like the rhetoric, but I don't believe that what they did was right in the video. So, they did stick up for half of it.

CORNISH: OK. So, this has moved from a conversation about calling for political violence in response to what Trump had to say over the weekend, to was Mark Kelly right or wrong to do X, Y, and Z? Can you talk about, like, what you're seeing about how the story is shifting? GABBY BIRNBAUM, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, "THE TEXAS TRIBUNE": Yes, I mean, I think the point that Maria brought up, right, the fundraising thing, I think is a critical piece of this. Mark Kelly could run for president. He'd be a compelling candidate, right? He's a veteran, which is what the whole story is about here.

I mean, this fundraising email writes itself, right? Pete Hegseth threatened to court-martial me. Can you give me $5? I mean, that's a pretty compelling subject line, right? On the one hand.

[06:20:09]

On the other hand, I mean, I think this is sort of the latest example, right? I mean, to see the Pentagon sort of tweet out information about an active senator who sits on Armed Services, right, who conducts oversight and sets policy for the Pentagon, to sort of an institution that predates Trump, that will, you know, ostensibly be around after Trump, is sort of bending to his will here for what he wants. I think it's just sort of another example of that trend.

CORNISH: OK.

CARDONA: The other thing is that Mark Kelly is kind of a beloved figure. He's an astronaut, you know.

CORNISH: Yes.

CARDONA: So, he's kind of iconic. I don't think this is going to work for the administration.

CORNISH: I don't know if there's beloved figures in this era of partisanship. We're about to find out.

CARDONA: This is one of them.

CORNISH: You guys stay with me. We've got a lot more to talk about.

After the break on CNN THIS MORNING, health insurance premiums are about to skyrocket. President Trump, meanwhile, is delaying his plan to affect those prices.

Plus, it's the age of technology. But is too much tech ruining the classroom?

And good morning to Houston.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:25:20]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have been a tech teacher for over 23 years.

I have to say, I hate what technology has done to our children. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why won't they pick up a book? My kids don't

read. My kids can't write a sentence, because all we stinking do is throw stimulation at them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: First, it was smartphones. Now laptops are facing pushback, too. More and more parents are saying enough to all the tech in classrooms.

But remember when laptops were a lifeline during the pandemic?

Now, "The New York Times" says that an informal survey showed 99 percent of teachers said their schools are handing them out tents, even kindergartners, and parents are really starting to talk about it. Maybe because so many are already fighting the screen time battle at home.

So, does it matter if kids are online all day at school? The person to help me out is Anya Kamenetz. She's a journalist at "The Golden Hour," and she's the author of a book called "The Art of Screen Time."

Anya, you're the perfect person for this. Good morning.

ANYA KAMENETZ, JOURNALIST/AUTHOR: Good morning, Audie.

CORNISH: So, during the pandemic, school closures, quarantines, virtual classrooms were kind of all we had in many communities.

Are we seeing a shift now as everybody is back and -- and teachers have had to deal with kids who are used to learning on screens?

KAMENETZ: Oh, absolutely. I mean, there's been a remarkable turnaround in the last few years, and schools are really feeling emboldened, I think, to draw new lines around technology.

We saw a surge in schools and states, actually, at the state level, banning phones in schools. Twenty-six states are now restricting phone usage in schools.

And you know, what I heard from school leaders is really it's the emotional attachment to their phones; not really being able to socialize or put the phone down that they were trying to restrict.

And so, with that, you know, relatively successful, the evidence on learning is mixed, but the phone bans are here. I think they're here to stay. And so, that's why we're looking at these other devices, as well, in schools.

CORNISH: But do we know? Is there any kind of research about outcomes and laptop use?

KAMENETZ: You know, there's findings going back a decade that student learning actually suffers; that when there's more computer use in schools. And that comes from an OECD. So, comparing all the rich countries taking the same test, they actually -- and it was a big surprise at the time, in 2015.

They found that school systems that had more computer use, which tended to be, you know, the more privileged countries, actually had less student learning. So, you know, that's one study. And it has been sometimes confirmed.

But I think, you know, the thing that we can say is that computers in school, they do serve a purpose. They are there for, oftentimes, assessments. They can be there for differentiating. So, giving kids, you know, certain types of lessons that are at their particular level.

But they're not a panacea, and they're not going to magically improve learning. We can definitely say that.

CORNISH: Before I let you go, I was thinking about something you said earlier, which is that it's one thing to use computers in class. It's another thing to have kind of digital literacy. And I'm trying to figure out is that a little bit like using money but not knowing how to make a budget?

KAMENETZ: Oh, my gosh. I mean, this is a core competency for the world that we live in, right? We need to be able to learn to -- to use technology, to use A.I. I mean, A.I. has come in and revolutionized the way that people interact, let alone do their work.

And so, if schools don't train and support teachers to support their students to use technology, well, they're not really preparing them for the world as it is today.

CORNISH: That's Anya Kamenetz. You can find her newsletter on Substack. It's called "The Golden Hour."

And straight ahead on CNN THIS MORNING, he's the most powerful man in medicine. RFK shaping policy, based on what he thinks is best. And the American people are the ones who will face the consequences.

Plus, a big shock after a coffin arrived at a temple in Thailand. The woman inside was about to be cremated until she started knocking.

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